2019 India-Pakistani border clash

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gelgoog

Brigadier
Registered Member
Indian navy is on the move
Our Southern flank is weak, air force and army can handle the rest in the North/East
China should send its carrier strike group to Bay of Bengal to the split the Indian defences in half
Otherwise Pakistan should not rule out the use of nuclear attack on the Indian navy
Pakistan navy doesnt have its SSK and FFG fleet up to its full strength yet, very vulnerable

I don't see China getting directly involved unless Pakistan was in immediate danger. Especially now that trade negotiations are in progress.
Doesn't Pakistan have anti-ship missiles?
 
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Biscuits

Major
Registered Member
C'mon now.o_O


China has no true Aegis system. Only an Aegis "like" system.

Do you fellows really think China will get involved in this dispute? Hopefully this conflict can be settled peacefully.

Yeah stupid choice of words from me, AEGIS is just a brand name, like Big Mac or KFC.

What I mean is area air defense, missile defense and radar coverage, which the DDGs do excel at.

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Look at it this way: if war starts and China doesn’t involve itself, it’s just a question of numbers until populous India overwhelms Pakistan. But Pakistan is a nuclear country, so it will likely nuke the Indians once they get too far inside the country.

Aside from fallout problems, China will lose both Pakistan and India in such a scenario. So it has no choice but to interfere sooner or later if war starts
 

plawolf

Lieutenant General
China has no true Aegis system. Only an Aegis "like" system.

C'mon now.o_O Do you fellows really think China will get involved in this dispute? Hopefully this conflict can be settled peacefully.

As for the Chinese CV getting involved. CV-16 just started sea trials after a minor re-fit. It would take weeks for it to work up to a combat status.

True. this thing could scale out of control quickly.

China has invested heavily in Pakistan. Whatmore, Pakistan is the first step on its new Belt and Road initiative. It is hard to overestimate the importance of that initiative to China’s future continued prosperity.

That initiative will be dead and buried if this dispute escalates and goes nuclear.

Not to mention the fact that China neighbors both nations and could easily get a heavy does of fall out over large parts of its own territory.

As such, it is very much in China’s national interest to make sure this thing doesn’t spiral out of all control. If that means strong arming the Indians into not doing anything else stupid to inflame tensions, I doubt anyone outside of India would loose any sleep over it.

If the IN starts messing around in the Indian Ocean taking pot shots at ships or Pakistani naval/land targets, the PLAN could re-task it’s anti-piracy task group to conduct some genuine FONOPs and tail the IN fleet. I would not be surprised if the re-tasking order has already been given.

The implied threat is that if the IN ships launch weapons at Pakistani targets, the PLAN will document that first act of aggression and datalink the IN fleet’s position to Pakistan to conduct retaliatory strikes.

The goal is simply to raise the costs of military misadventures on the part of the Indians to the extend that not even Modi would be willing to risk it.
 

gelgoog

Brigadier
Registered Member
Well, China did supply all that capital to the CPEC precisely so that Pakistan/China could support each other.
AFAIK the highway to China has already been built and the rail segment is under construction.

I think if the Indians were planning on doing a full mobilization we would have seen that already. The Chinese probably will refrain from sending troops to try to prevent the situation from escalating further. But yes if Pakistan was in danger of an actual land invasion the Chinese would definitively intervene.
 

localizer

Colonel
Registered Member
Well, China did supply all that capital to the CPEC precisely so that Pakistan/China could support each other.
AFAIK the highway to China has already been built and the rail segment is under construction.

I think if the Indians were planning on doing a full mobilization we would have seen that already. The Chinese probably will refrain from sending troops to try to prevent the situation from escalating further. But yes if Pakistan was in danger of an actual land invasion the Chinese would definitively intervene.

china only only send equipment to them.
 

ZeEa5KPul

Colonel
Registered Member
China has invested heavily in Pakistan. Whatmore, Pakistan is the first step on its new Belt and Road initiative. It is hard to overestimate the importance of that initiative to China’s future continued prosperity.

That initiative will be dead and buried if this dispute escalates and goes nuclear.

Not to mention the fact that China neighbors both nations and could easily get a heavy does of fall out over large parts of its own territory.

As such, it is very much in China’s national interest to make sure this thing doesn’t spiral out of all control. If that means strong arming the Indians into not doing anything else stupid to inflame tensions, I doubt anyone outside of India would loose any sleep over it.

If the IN starts messing around in the Indian Ocean taking pot shots at ships or Pakistani naval/land targets, the PLAN could re-task it’s anti-piracy task group to conduct some genuine FONOPs and tail the IN fleet. I would not be surprised if the re-tasking order has already been given.

The implied threat is that if the IN ships launch weapons at Pakistani targets, the PLAN will document that first act of aggression and datalink the IN fleet’s position to Pakistan to conduct retaliatory strikes.

The goal is simply to raise the costs of military misadventures on the part of the Indians to the extend that not even Modi would be willing to risk it.
Great points, especially about Modi. Can't have a hot-headed dummy like him derail the Rise of China. Do you think China's already providing ISR assistance to Pakistan?
 

plawolf

Lieutenant General
Great points, especially about Modi. Can't have a hot-headed dummy like him derail the Rise of China. Do you think China's already providing ISR assistance to Pakistan?

Probably not active ISR support as the goal is de-escalation not to tempt Pakistan to take pot shots at particularly choice targets of opportunity.

But if the Chinese spot a crashed MKI on the Indian side of the line, I’m sure they won’t mind sharing those with the Pakistanis.
 

Hendrik_2000

Lieutenant General
The JF-17 can supposedly use anti-ship missiles so if sea defense is a concern then purchases of the anti-ship missiles should be made.

I though they already have anti ship missile and they tested it back in 2018

The new CM-400 antiship test image. 2~3 times faster than india Brahmos missiles(CM-400AKG flies at 4march to 6 march). And it can fire further than it(300km range for CM-400AKG).

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jugm-fyrswmu3895744-jpg.455190


SY-400 / CM-400AKG
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The 7th China International Aviation & Aerospace Exhibition was held on November 4th to 9th, 2008 in Zhuhai Airshow Centre, South China's Guangdong province. A new set of Chinese missile equipment, including the SY 400 rocket-powered guided missile weapon system, made its debut [Shen Ying, meaning Divine Eagle]. China is calling it as a guided artillery rocket system, hence claiming the 400 km range missile it is not limited by the 300 km range MTCR export restrictions. Capable of carrying an HE, fragment, submunition and EMP payload, other sources give this solid fueled SRBM an estimated range of 200km, well below the MTCR-mandated 300km restriction.

SY-400 system from the outset was designed as a tactic to-surface missiles, with a wing mainly used to increase the missile body lift, increasing the missile's gliding distance and improve range. The wing also plays a role in strengthening the the longitudinal strength, in order to avoid intense elastic oscillation.

SY-400 is not purely ballistic missiles since the end of the active segment, there is a very long flight distance, in this period of time, the missile had burn engine, the rudder has no gas for gas deflection, how the error correction produced during this time, only a control surface by air. The vane is only supporting the vertical launch system, gas in the vertical direction after the launch target deflection direction. So after the operation, will be discarded, after which control relis on the air rudder.

The main mix is based on a range, SY-400 for 180 km within the tactical support, as more tactical targets, so the use of smaller missiles, can attack several targets. The BP-12A is generally used for fire support battle, a maximum range of 300 kilometers, this is mainly because of the Missile Technology Control Regime restricting the export of missiles with a range of 300 kilometers.

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Versatility has always been to improve national weapons development. For example, with 10 launch vehicles, as close to full support, these could have 80 SY-400, used for a remote support, can have 20 BP-12A, if the 10 private launch vehicles, that is, 5 vehicles SY-400, 5 BP-12A is the largest number of 40 SY400, 10 BP-12A, the task fell a lot of flexibility. SY-400 and BP-12A are using GPS / INS guidance, CEP of 30 meters, if the military code GPS system, or the military code of the Compass 2 system, and that accuracy can be further improved.

The CM-400AKG supersonic standoff missile was first on display at the 2012 Zhuhai Airshow as part of FC-1/JF-17's "complete" weapon package. Unlike most modern ASMs flying at the low altitude, the missile flies a rare high ballistic trajectory, powered by a solid rocket motor. It appears that CM-400AKG may have evolved from the earlier SY-400 SRBM. Therefore the effectiveness of such attack profile is still unknown.

The missile has a weight of 900kg, maximum range of 240 km, max speed Mach 5.5 (at diving stage?). It has INS during the mid-course and utilizes active radar/passive radar/IIR seeker with target-recognition capabilities at the terminal stage, which may improve its accuracy. The missile is claimed to be capable of terminal maneuver in some degree to avoid interception by SAM. CM-400AKG is speculated to have been designed to attack fixed or "slow moving", high value ground targets. It has yet to be confirmed that CM-400AGK is in service with PAF's JF-17.
 
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