Taiwan military news and discussion part II

President optimistic about U.S. arms sales

CNA
Sunday, August 31, 2008



TAIPEI, Taiwan -- President Ma Ying-jeou expressed optimism for the first time yesterday about the p

ossibility of the United States giving the green light for the sale of a package of weapon systems to Taiwan.

In recent weeks, Ma has repeatedly taken advantage of his meetings with visiting American congressional members and think tank scholars to urge the U.S. government to quickly approve the sale of seven categories of weapons that Taiwan intends to buy.

Addressing a gathering of retired generals yesterday to mark the upcoming Armed Forces Day and Mid-Autumn Festival, Ma said that judging from recent developments, he is convinced that the United States will give a nod to Taiwan's arms procurement bid in the not too distant future.

"Recent signs show that the U.S. administrative department would notify Congress of its approval of our arms procurement package that covers seven types of weaponry," Ma told his audience.

The pending items are anti-tank missiles, Apache helicopters, Patriot PAC-3 missile batteries, diesel-powered submarines, P3C anti submarine aircraft and sea-launched Harpoon missiles and Black Eagle helicopters.

In his speech, Ma also said that recent improvements in relations across the Taiwan Strait should by no means be interpreted as a government attempt to give up efforts to enhance the country's defense capabilities.

Emphasizing the importance of honing the military's combat prowess and improving its defense arsenal, Ma said combat preparedness is not to wage war, but rather to deter war.

"Only with powerful defense muscle can we negotiate with strength in future cross-strait talks, " Ma explained, adding that Taiwan cannot afford to negotiate with weak military capabilities.

While Taiwan is more than willing to champion cross-strait reconciliation and pursue permanent peace on both the military and diplomatic fronts, Ma said, such lofty goals cannot be realized unilaterally.

Noting that upholding peace is at the core of commemorating the country's Sept. 3 Armed Forces Day, Ma said his administration will not miss any opportunity or possibility to advance or maintain permanent cross-strait peace.

^ Why have you posted that twice?

LOL = =".....My BAD.....I think I was wasted when I got home....and tired too. Sorry about that, I'll look before I post next time. ^^

The Best Defense is a defense????

=====================================
Presidential Office skirts missile report
TOUGH TALKING: A KMT legislator said Taiwan should go ahead with plans to develop long-range missiles and that the president has yet to present a clear defense strategy
By Ko Shu-Ling
STAFF REPORTER, WITH AP
Tuesday, Sep 02, 2008, Page 3

The Presidential Office yesterday skirted speculation that the military has stopped developing offensive long-range missiles, but emphasized that Taiwan would not start a conflict in the Taiwan Strait.

The remarks came after a report by the Chinese-language China Times yesterday said the military had test-fired an advanced Hsiung Feng missile with a range of 800km in January, but had now halted work on it in line with President Ma Ying-jeou’s (馬英九) attempts to improve relations with China.

The Hsiung Feng IIE surface-to-surface cruise missile is a program that was started during the former Democratic Progressive Party (DPP) administration.

RELIABLE SOURCES

The China Times report quoted “reliable sources” in the armed forces as saying that the military had planned to develop a model with a range of 1,000km, which would put Shanghai within its range.

However, they decided to halt the plans, taking into consideration improved cross-strait relations and a shift in military strategy to a more defensive stance.

Presidential Office Spokesman Wang Yu-chi (王郁琦) yesterday said the media should ask the Ministry of National Defense (MND) why it had decided to cease development of the missiles.

“The president’s defense policy is clear,” Wang said. “We will not take the initiative to attack, nor will we attack any non-military facilities.”

When asked whether the halt in development work was a gesture of goodwill toward Beijing, Wang said it would only help the country’s long-term development if cross-strait relations were to improve.

Chinese Nationalist Party (KMT) Legislator Shuai Hua-ming (帥化民) yesterday said Taiwan should go ahead with plans to develop the missiles.

“Because the mainland keeps developing missiles with higher precision and longer ranges, we must keep up our weapons programs intact,” Shuai, an influential retired army general, said.

Taiwan reportedly test-fired a Hsiung Feng IIE missile with a range of 600km in October 2004, but the military has never displayed or deployed it.

Shuai said Ma has yet to present a clear, plausible defense strategy even as he pursues a vaguely defined peace treaty with China.

BUDGET

Last week, the military proposed a defense budget for next year of NT$395.3 billion (US$12.5 billion), a decline of NT$53.9 billion (US$1.7 billion) from the previous year.

In response to the China Times report, the MND yesterday released a press statement, saying only that developing domestic-made weapons is in line with policy to protect the homeland.

The MND also said it “would not use weapons to attack civilian targets.”

Meanwhile, Wang yesterday dismissed speculation that Ma and the MND were inconsistent on the number of weapons the country is seeking to buy from the US.

While the MND has said that the US Congress is to review an eight-item purchase plan, Ma said on Saturday that all signs indicated that the White House would soon ask Congress to complete legal procedures for seven items that Taiwan has requested from Washington.

Wang said Ma and the MND only “talked about the same thing from different angles.”

Wang said the seven items Ma mentioned referred to the weapons the US Congress would agree to sell, while the eight items were what Taiwan would like to purchase from the US.

How come one article has said that the defence budget for next year will be a touch over $10 billion and the other $12.5 billion?

kliu, not quite sure what you mean - are you concerned they're getting rid of the whole project? I heard they've decided to put money into making the missile more accurate/reliable rather than getting the range up to 1000km and beyond.

They aren't producing anymore Hsiung Feng IIEs because its not compliant with the "national defence strategy", instead focusing all the money into investing and mass producing the Hsiung Feng III Supersonic Anti-ship missiles. I'm just worried that with the Hsiung Feng IIE going, we won't have enough deterrant force.

Originally Posted by kliu0

They aren't producing anymore Hsiung Feng IIEs because its not compliant with the "national defence strategy"

Where did you get that from? My understanding is that HF-IIE production will continue, just not the extended range version - so it will be limited to 600-800km.

Lol....i got it from Taiwan news, but meh...they must be wrong cause I double checked on the internet. So yea, you're right....sorry about the confusion....But still.....they should continue developing the range of the missile. I mean that sort of development can be copied onto other missile defense platforms such as the Sky Bow and possible more advancement into indigenous weaponary.

Horses for courses. Maybe researching a longer-range missile could have implications for other weapon systems, but the same could be said about improving accuracy and reliability. Then there's more money going into the HF-III which is also good.

For myself I think improved accuracy is better than a longer range at this point.

For the HF-III They should make it more accurate and reliable as you said. But they should continue making the HF-IIE faster, accurate and longer range.

Originally Posted by kliu0

But they should continue making the HF-IIE faster, accurate and longer range.

Can't have your cake and eat it. If there is only a set amount of money for R&D, you may only be able to focus on one thing. Even if there were more resources, I would focus on accuracy first.

HF-III needs to be reduced in weight and size above all, so that it can be fitted into ships, small or large, best missile in this class today is the Russian/Indian Brahmos, although supersonic missiles tend to be not so agile and easy to detect.

It can fit into the ROCN's ships. Some have already been fitted and are into service. The HF-II are still fitted onto smaller ships. Of course it is expected that the newer updated versions of the HF-III will be smaller and weigh less because of advancements into technologically, but there are some things that cant be minimised.

This is a really good article....sorry its in mandarin. You can use auto translate or something to read it.

Ｆ─十六買不買？ 軍與府方不同調
2008-09-01 中國時報 【吳明杰／台北報導】
　台灣到底要不要向美國採購F-16C/D戰機？國防部長陳肇敏上周才說要繼續爭取，總統馬英九卻只提對美「七項軍購」，等同把戰機採購案排除，府 方、軍方對此購案至今的不同調，不僅國內、美方都看得一頭霧水，這項預計花費近一千五百億預算的重大軍購案 也演變成羅生門，不知誰說的算。

　另一方面，美方對這項對台軍售案的走向也渾沌不明，據了解，我空軍司令彭勝竹上將上月才受邀訪問華府，在 與五角大廈高層官員會晤時，美國軍方仍對這項軍售案抱以「期待」的正面態度，另早先有消息指布希可能在北京 奧運後宣布同意這項軍售案，不過同樣至今沒有任何新進展。

　國防部長陳肇敏在八月二十四日、二十六日分別在金門和台北接受記者詢問時強調，為了汰除舊有 的F-5E型戰機，台灣還是會繼續向美方提出F-16C/D型戰機的要求，如果今年美方仍未同意，國防部明年還會繼續向美方爭取，軍方目前還在等待美方的 回應。

　不過，馬總統在三十日卻表示，台灣希望採購的「七項武器」，美國政府應該會通知國會，完成法定手續，隨後 又有府方人士指出，國防部根本沒向美方提出過 F-16C/D戰機採購意向書，這項說法，不僅與軍方說法有極大出入，也形同在這項採購案上「鳴金收兵」，潑了國防部一 桶冷水。

　對於台灣國防部是否曾向美方提出F-16C/D戰機採購意向書，以及美方是否同意這項軍購案，前國防部長李傑曾在民國九十五年十月二日在立法院公開指出 ，美方負責軍購的「第二號人物」當年八月曾來台已與我方談妥，美國在台協會台北辦事處也承諾將會提供戰機的 報價資料，未料後來卻都一直沒有下文，經軍方了解才知道，是五角大廈向美國總統布希報告時，已遭布希指示「 暫停」。

　據指出，我空軍準備向美採購的F-16C/D型戰機案，原在前年四月及七月透過軍購溝通管道，曾獲五角大廈官員私下承諾布希政府將會同意這項軍售案， 不過都僅止於口頭承諾，我方雖有意提出採購意向書，不過因當時台美政治氣氛不佳，美軍方才一直要我軍方「先 緩緩」，至今還是沒有依過去軍購程序向美方遞出採購意向書，但卻已經連續三年編列預算。
http://news.chinatimes.com/2007Cti/2...100063,00.html


國防大事 怎可和稀泥
2008-09-01 中國時報 【吳明杰／特稿】
　馬英九總統最近談到對美軍購都只提「七項武器」，而不提「八項軍購」，刻意將F-16C/D戰機採購案切割，似乎印證外傳台灣因戰略改變可能放棄這項戰機採購的說法；然國防部長陳肇敏上周才說將繼 續爭取這項軍購案，軍方也在明年度預算編列廿七億元採購經費。若非府方、軍方溝通有問題，就是馬政府已開始 出現「說一套、做一套」的毛病。

　關於F-16C/D戰機採購案，馬政府從上台前就開始「槍口對自己」，先是相關人士向美放話台灣不想買，讓美方友台人士感到 訝異。最近又有府方人士藉機痛批國防部根本沒向美方提出過採購意向書，甚至直指在美方未同意前軍方就編列預 算，明顯違反《預算法》，這種「教訓」軍方的作法，也讓軍方人士私下頗有微詞。

　其實，馬總統上任後，除了每周一和國防部長、參謀總長仍舊維持「小軍談」體制之外，每個月還有召集上將召 開的「大軍談」，對於涉及預算高達一千五百億的 F-16C/D重大軍購案，軍方沒有理由未曾向總統提報過，而馬英九也不可能沒有過問。在有充分溝通管道下，府方、軍方 居然對採購F-16C/D問題一再出現不同調，令人不可思議。截至目前為止，國防部對採購F-16C/D戰機的態度和立場一直很明確，除了公開表示將繼續向美方爭取外，也繼續編列第三年預算，只要軍方有高層官 員赴美，就會努力遊說美方同意這項影響台海空防至鉅的軍售案。

　只不過馬總統至今未對這項有重大爭議性的軍購案表態，甚至演變成一場羅生門。也就是說，不僅美國沒說要賣 ，連我方也沒說要買，軍方甚至得有讓現有戰機再撐十年的心理準備，馬政府處理國防議題如此和稀泥，實在讓關 心台灣安全的人快看不下去了。
http://news.chinatimes.com/2007Cti/2...100064,00.html