SinoDefence Forum

Jeff Head

The Russians are conducting in depth and impressive training in the Atlantic as we speak. They have their carrier, the Admiral Kuznetsov there with an entire strike group consisting of the missile cruiser Moskva (Slava Class), the strong anti-submarine guided missile destroyer, the Admiral Levchenko (Udaloy class), the strong anti-submarine guided missile destroyer, the Admiral Chabenenko (Udaloy II class), and two fleet tanker/oilers the Sergai Osipov and the Ivan Bubnov.

These vessles are conducting strike at sea, interdiction, ans sea control operations and will be joined by large numbers of Russian strike aircraft over the next few weeks. Aircraft fro Russian bases including TU-160 Blackjack Bombers, TU-22M Naval Strike aircraft, TU-95 recon and strike aircraft, AEW, refueling and other aircraft will converge with sorties working in multi-role and multi-service exercises.

More on these exercises can be found HERE-Russian News and Information Agency

Here are fifteen excellent pictures of the exercises and the ships involved:

Admiral Kuznetsov carrier operations:








Admiral Kuznetsov carrier deck operations:






Moskva, Slava Class Guided missile cruiser:



Admiral Chabanenko, Udaloy II class guided missile destroyer



Admiral Levchenko, Udaloy class guided missile destroyer



Ivan Bubnov, Fleet tanker



Segei Osipov, Fleet tanker




The Varyag (by whatever name the PLAN ultimately commissions her) will one day perform training exercises similar to this and the members of this forum can get a feel for what that day will be like by observing her sister ship, the Kuznetsov.

Substitute a Type 52C and perhaps a Type 51C guided missile destroyer, at least one type 52B guided missile destroyer, and a couple of Type 54A guided missile frigates, along with one or two replenishment vessels, and you will envision a PLAN strike group one day in the next few yers in the China Sea or the western Pacific.

bd popeye

Nice PIX Jeff! Where on Earth did you find them?? Those are some great PIX of the vernable Russian CV.

Any information about how many aircrfat are deployed in the CVW of the ADM"K" would be appericated.

__________________
Discover the Chinese and World Military picture threads!


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 5 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


..And the Chinese Daily Life Photo thread!!


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 5 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


..And don't forget

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 5 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


"I am what I am.... 'Dat's all what I am"

Jeff Head

Those are the best pics I have ever found and actually show ops with armed and loaded flankers, as opposed to what we almost always see...flankers taking off empty.

I counted 10 fixed-wing aircraft on deck and a couple of helos. One or two SU-25 Frogfoots and the rest Flankers for the fixed wing. I do not know how many aircraft and helos are in the hanger.

Jeff Head

Thought you guys might find this article interesteing, particularly the pics.

Make sure you click on them and look at the high-res versions.

Cheers...Jeff

tphuang

actually, the Russians did a far better job than I expected. They actually put a decent showcase out there with long range refueling and AWACS involved. It shows that the refit work they did on their major ships worked out quite well.

Jeff Head

Agreed thphuang. This manuever demostrates a multi/mixed arms capability far superior to most nations except the US. With their very capable (even if few in number) bombers, strike aircraft, refueling, recon, and AEW acting in concert with their carrier strike group at significant distances from their shores, they are showing that their ability to interdict and fight for sea control is still very substantial...if limited in terms of numbers.

I believe that mixed arms capability could meet and defeat (if it found them) any other nation's at sea capability with the exception of the US and perhaps the French. The ability to get the refueling, the heavy strike aircraft, the larger AEW and recon aircraft into position to augment their carrier does that for them. Really, at the present time, only the US and France can meet it.

Ultimately China and Japan will have the same capabilites.

Finn McCool

With Russia fluch with oil wealth and the military high in Putin's priority list, it is no surprise that the Adm.K is conducting operations like this. It's about giving the Russian Navy some of its pride back. This is more than we've seen from them in a while; Adm. K actually has some aircraft on the flight deck. As the Russian Nacy's budget rises, which it probably will, we should see the issue of "small numbers" which someone raised matter less. If they could have one strike group this size able to deploy like they did in the operation in the Atlantic and the Pacific, then the Russian Navy would matter in a way that it hasn't in years. But that is all very long term For now, the Kuznestov is looking better than it has in while.

About the pics: The Soviets sure did make some intimdating, brawny looking ships. Not very stealty, but they look like big brutes.

__________________
Battles are won by slaughter and maneuver. The greater the general, the more he contributes in maneuver, the less he demands in slaughter.
-Winston Churchill

Jeff Head

If they had two such groups in each major Ocean (ie. Atlantic and Pacific), so that one could be avaliable at all times, I would say that the numbers thing was less important.

Even one on each side would help...but now they only have the one. But that one is looking good with these exercises.

As to the vessels...yes, the Russian vessels are very heavily armed and built to be menacing. But...though they look that way, their ability to reload those principle missile tubes is extremely limited when compared to their western counterparts.

tphuang

yeah, I was quite impressed by the bomber, strike aircraft and the entire air arm joining in. That was quite unexpected. It shows that even through the lack of training, they still managed to keep some level of joint operation between the navy and the air force. Most of us (at least I) sure overlooked their capabilities. Also of interest, I think it's worth noting that the last sortie by Adm K was so bad that not many people expected a lot out of it this time. They must have done a lot of work on it.

crazyinsane105

Are the Russians by any chance using the Syrian port or no?

Russian naval forces to be deployed in Mediterranean Sea using Syrian ports...

It would be interesting if one day both the Syrian and Russian naval forces conducted a joint exercise...

bd popeye

Yesterday I'm sure I made a post in this thread and today I find it gone. Curious..Oh well..

The Russian are putting on a good "show" with the ADM "K" and it's limited ablities. Never the less it is a good show of force.

As some who actually served on aircraft carriers I can tell you first hand that CVs need to be at sea to learn to operate in a proficent manner. A ships crew cannot be trained sitting in port.

I sure would like to know the Russian operational tempo during this at sea period. Any ideas??

What the Russians need to do to improve it's CV ops is;

1) Spend more time at sea operating the lone Russian CV!
2) Learn how to land at night on a CV. Right now they are not capable of night ops..
3) Consider installing a catapult on thst ship. Perferably on the angle deck.
4) Spend more time at sea operating the lone Russian CV!
5) Spend more time at sea operating the lone Russian CV!
6) Spend more time at sea operating the lone Russian CV!

Just my opinion.

__________________
Discover the Chinese and World Military picture threads!


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 5 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


..And the Chinese Daily Life Photo thread!!


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 5 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


..And don't forget

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 5 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


"I am what I am.... 'Dat's all what I am"

Tasman

They are certainly the best I have seen and the first I have seen of a Russian carrier with armed, operational aircraft.

Is the Russian practice of restricting the number of embarked aircraft to those that can be stowed in the hangar a result of extreme weather conditions or the fact that the number of aircraft available is limited?

Avoiding the use of a permanent deck park would certainly increase the service life of naval aircraft but it also limits the potential of these ships. A compromise would be to carry a limited airgroup most of the time but to embark a full size group by using a deck park during major exercises.

Tas

Jeff Head

Amen Popeye! The carrier looks better than I have seen it in a long time...but they Russians will not be served well if, after this exercise, they button her up for 2-3 years before any other major exercises. They should take her out 2-3 times a year. And in order to really make it pay off, they need another vessel so when this one goes into refit they can continue training and exercises unabated.

Me too Tasman. It is nice to finally see them training in full. I do not believe I have ever seen pictures of them with armed aircraft...though that certainly does not mean they haven't done it.

I do not know. There may be more in the hanger spaces in these pics. I just can not tell/ I would be surprised if the total embarked airwing was 14 fixed wing and two helos. Those helos look like SAR. I would think they had a few more aircraft and helos in the hanger spaces. Maybe 20 aircraft, 2-4 SAR/ASW helos and three AEW helos. But do not know.

Lociz

i have been experiencing the same thing several times on this forum. I do like this forum and some of the post are of big interest, but I am giving up soon. There is something seriously wrong with the forum. That or someone is deleting my posts..

Been loking for information about the Kuznetsov airwing since the deployment startet. Seems like they only have 12-15 Flanker-D operative, so those pics are probably showing mostly all. Should be no problem storing alot more Helix in the hangar though, but all pictures i have seen from the deployment is showing only 2-3 on deck. Probably one or two for Search and Rescue, maybe one fitted for ASW, and one for early warning.
Not so impressed about the paintjob on the ships They have been on a long voyage, but cant say that I have seen other nations surface-ships looking so bad during a deployment..

Neutral Zone

And as soon as resources permit, get another one! That would give their pilots and shipcrews more experience. With the way relations between Russia and the West are going there's certainly going to be a lot of money going into the Russian Navy in the next decade. Has there been any word about a Kuznetsov replacement? Maybe something like a larger version of India's new carriers would suit Russia's needs?