SinoDefence Forum

crazyinsane105

I wonder how many batteries the Iranians are planning to order. How much does a single battery of an S-300 cost though? I heard it costs up to 300 million USD, but I think I am wrong. Anyway, the Iranians have wanted this missile since 2003, and I guess they'll be happy they're going to be able to buy it.


Iran to get missile system from Russia: report

Wed Dec 26, 10:36 AM ET

TEHRAN (Reuters) - Russia has agreed to sell an S-300 anti-aircraft missile system to Iran, Iran's defense minister was quoted as saying on Wednesday, a report likely to irritate the United States.

S-300 missiles are longer-ranging than the TOR-M1 surface-to-air missiles which Russia, in a deal criticized by the West, earlier this year said it had delivered to the Islamic Republic under a $1 billion contract.

Iran is under U.N. sanctions over its refusal to halt sensitive atomic work that Western powers suspect it wants to master so that it can build nuclear bombs, but they do not ban conventional weapons sales to the country.

"The S-300 system, under a contract signed in the past with Russia, will be delivered to Iran," Defense Minister Mostafa Mohammad Najjar told Fars News Agency, without giving details.

"The timing of the delivery ... will be announced later," he said. The ISNA news agency carried a similar report.

The United States and Israel -- Tehran's arch foes -- have said Iran could use the TOR-M1 system to attack its neighbors. Russia says it is a short-range system and purely defensive.

Najjar said last month Iran would never launch an attack against another country but warned that anybody trying to invade Iran would "face a crushing response."

Under Russian President Vladimir Putin, Russian arms firms have aggressively pushed sales abroad as the Kremlin seeks to reassert its role as a global power in the Middle East, Asia and Latin America.

Russia's drive to boost arms exports have raised tensions with the United States, which last year imposed sanctions on Russia's state arms trader Rosoboronexport for cooperating with Iran, a move Moscow has called illegal.

The United States is pushing for a third set of U.N. sanctions against Iran over its disputed atomic activities, even though a U.S. intelligence report this month said Tehran had halted its nuclear weapons program in 2003.

Iran says it has never had plans to build nuclear bombs, insisting its program is peaceful and aimed at generating electricity so that it can export more of its oil and gas.

Russia said on December 17 it had delivered the first shipment of nuclear fuel to the Bushehr power plant in southern Iran, a step Moscow and Washington said should persuade Tehran to shut down its own controversial uranium enrichment program, which can have both civilian and military uses.

(Reporting by Zahra Hosseinian, Writing by Fredrik Dahl; editing by Richard Meares)


http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20071226/...sia_missile_dc

RedMercury

Heh, more like, if the Russian wait any longer, the Chinese will sell HQ-9 to them.

flyzies

How effective the new Iranian S-300s will be ultimately depend on how many batteries they receive. And i highly doubt theyll get enough units to defend every inch of their airspace.

But i think this move by Iran is aimed more at Israel than the US, it gets across the "you cant take me on that easily" point.

crazyinsane105

There was no immediate official confirmation of the new delivery from Russia, but the Interfax news agency quoted a senior Russian defence source as saying Iran would receive several dozen of the systems.

“In line with the contract signed several years ago, Russia will deliver to Iran several dozen 3RS S-300PMU1 anti-aircraft systems,” the source said AFP

flyzies

And now it seems Russia is denying the whole thing...

http://www.reuters.com/article/newsM...55739020071228

ccL1

Instead of bragging about it, why wouldn't the Iranian leadership just stay quiet? Why do they have to announce everything before any transaction actually occurs?

I wouldn't be surprised at all if Russia scuttles the sale.

crazyinsane105

Odd, this has been happening for a while. The manufacturers are confirming the sale while the Russian government is denying...what's going on?


Russia to Deliver S-300 Missile Defense Systems to Iran
Iran will receive the first shipments of the Russian S-300 PMU-1 air/missile defense systems next year (2008), an unidentified defense industry source told the Russian news agency Interfax. The Russian agency confirmed the Iranian Defense Minister Mostafa Najjar quoted saying that Iran will soon receive the missiles, under a previously signed contract. Officially, the Russian federal service of military technical cooperation (FSMTS) denied the issue has been disclosed in Iran, or that such a contract has been signed, defining the the recent news as 'irrelevant'. However, the Russian newspaper Kommersant claimed the value of the S-300 sale is estimated at US$800 million. (More...)



The decision follows current Russian arms trade policy led by President Vladimir Putin, stressing Russian right to pursue opportunities regardless to US restrictions that effected Russian defense exports in recent years.

According to the Russian sources, the Iranians will receive five fire units of the the S-300 PMU-1 version, comprising 20 quad or twin launchers, supporting radars and command, control and communications systems. PMU-1 is the basic version offered by the Russians and, according to the Russian Kommersant daily newspaper, it is possible that the delivery will be made by withdrawing and modifying S-300s from active Russian Air Defense units. The PMU-1 is a relocatable system (towed by trucks) introduced in the early 1990s as an upgrade of the S-300 (SA-10) system, which replaced the SA-5 Gammon in Russian service in the 1980s. The PMU-1 upgrade was the first missile interceptor model of the SA-10, that represented the climax of the cold war, as these missiles provided the first defensive shield of Moscow. S-300 has become one of the most attractive defense export products, along with the Sukhoi Su-30 fighter and T-80 tank. Among the S-300 Operators are Russia, Belarus, Ukraine, Kazakhstan, Armenia, Bulgaria, Slovakia, China, Vietnam, Greece (transferred from Cyprus) and Algeria. Syria and Libya are also known to have the system on their wish list.

Further upgrades of the S-300 PMU-1 are the improved PMU-2 version (also known as Favorit or SA-20) this version is capable of intercepting aerodynamic targets at ranges up to 200 km. An equivalent, but all-terrain mobile system mounted on tracked chassis is the S-300V (equivalent of PMU-1) and the Antey 2500 system (S-300 VM or SA-23) - equivalent of the PMU-2 Favorit. All versions offer improved defense capability against aerodynamic and aero-ballistic targets, including aircraft, cruise missiles and ballistic missiles (fired from ranges of 2,500 km). These missiles are reportedly designed to operate against low-radar-cross-section targets, such as 'semi stealth' cruise missiles. Such characteristics are promising to provide the Iranians with defensive capability from potential Israeli threats, such as the Jericho II missiles, which reportedly have a range of 1,500 km. The missile defense footprint of all S-300 versions (PMU-1,2, S-300V or Antey 2500) is about 40 km. The S-300 has an effective anti-aircraft defense footprint of up to 200 km, dramatically increasing their air defense capability beyond current 'point defense' capabilities. Almaz-Antey is currently developing a further improved S-300 version called S-400 (S-300 PMU-3) designed as the next generation missile defense system. Most counries (apart from Russia) are using early models of S-300/S-300V variants. Vietnam and China are operating the the PMU-1 version while China aso deploy the PMU-2. Algeria is also interested in the system but according to Russian sources, the deal has not been finalized after recent setbacks in relations between Moscow and Algires.

This effect will introduce major limitation on the performance of potential cruise missile strikes such as the Tomahawk, JASSM or Storm Shadow. Furthermore, the acquisition of 'dozens' of S-300 systems, after the induction of TOR-1M into the Iranian air defense service hints of their capability to field an integrated air defense system based on the latest Russian doctrine, eying the TOR as the lower-tier defense, uses 'hard kill' against precision guided weapons fired from standoff range, beyond the SAM reach, enabling the long range SAM to maintain full operational capability even under intensive suppression by jamming and anti-radar missile attack.

Finn McCool

This reminds me of that report from a while back that Iran was going to buy 300 or so Su-30s. That was confirmed to be totally false.

This has the same sort of sound. Iran doesn't need "dozens" of batteries, and probably couldn't afford that many anyway. There has to be misinformation at work here.

__________________
Battles are won by slaughter and maneuver. The greater the general, the more he contributes in maneuver, the less he demands in slaughter.
-Winston Churchill

coolieno99

This is just my opinion. If the U.S. is going to plant ABM systems in Poland and Czechoslovakia over Russian objections, then Russia will respond by delivering the S-300 systems to Iran. Look likes a rebirth of the Cold War of the 1980's.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0etQs...eature=related

crazyinsane105

The report about the Su-30s was from Dubka, and that is a very unreliable source. The report I just posted up is from Defense Update, and they are much more reliable.

If the Iranians want to completely protect all their nuclear assets from an Israeli air attack, they're definitely going to need a lot of S-300s as a nuclear program (even a peaceful one) requires many facilities. The Iranians bought I think 24 Tor-M1 batteries last year so about two or three dozen batteries of S-300 would be good compensation, plus don't assume the Iranians can't afford it. They have one of the largest oil and natural gas reserves in the world, and much of their spending goes towards domestic defense purchases and R&D.

Finn McCool

Well I guess that depends on your definition of "dozens". Hearing that made me think of around 75 batteries which would be a little much, to say the least. However 24-30 is a much more believable number. It just isn't clear enough.

I guess will just have to wait a little bit to see whether the batteries are delivered or not. My guess is that they will be. The offical denial is probably just there to confuse the US while the sale is completed.

__________________
Battles are won by slaughter and maneuver. The greater the general, the more he contributes in maneuver, the less he demands in slaughter.
-Winston Churchill

Express12

The delivery of that S-300 will go ahead.

flyzies

And youre basing that on what exactly??

crazyinsane105

Amid conflicting reports that Moscow has agreed to sell Iran a number of S-300 low-to-high altitude air-defence systems emerging at the end of 2007, Jane's has learned that Tehran is actually in the final stage of negotiations with Belarus for the acquisition of two surplus trailer-mounted towed S-300PT (SA-10A 'Grumble') systems.

These systems were, until recently, deployed near Minsk as part of Belarus's operational air-defence configuration, and include command-guided Fakel 5V55K missiles (with a range of 47 km) and the baseline 5V55R semi-active radar and Track Via Missile (TVM) guided missile (range 75 km).

Defence industrial sources in Belarus told Jane's that although the value of the contract has yet to be finalised, Belarusian negotiators are asking for USD140 million for the two systems (including parts, maintenance and training). The sources noted that while that figure is considered high for older S-300PT systems (the S-300PT entered Soviet service as far back as 1978), the inflated price reflects an awareness of Iran's urgent requirement for such systems and its consequent willingness to pay well, enhanced by the intense international scrutiny placed on Tehran's efforts to acquire missile technologies and the country's difficulty to fast-track acquisition of such systems from other sources.

Further, the price also reflects the risk involved for Minsk in releasing such systems to Tehran - particularly in its political relations with Moscow.

The sources confirmed that after the contract is finalised, the S-300PT systems would be transferred from Belarus to Iran in semi-knocked down (SKD) condition aboard a number of cargo aircraft. These flights will fall within the framework of the many regular flights (including military aircraft) between Iran and Belarus, and will include the transfer of spare system parts as required by Iran.



Source: http://www.janes.com/news/defence/id...0117_1_n.shtml


Does anybody know how effective the S-300PT is when compared to modern SAM systems? And why does Iran all of a sudden have a huge urgency to be willing to pay for an older version of the S-300 when they could wait for a few months longer and get the newer versions from Russia?

unknauthr

I had heard from another source that the S-300 missiles that Iran was negotiating for with Moscow were likewise second-hand weapons, being replaced in Russian service with the S-400 system.

The Iranian air defense network is pretty antiquated. Pretty much anything would be an improvement for them. The Iranians recently took delivery of 29 Tor-M1 (SA-15) missile batteries from Russia, but compared to Iran's land area - their surface-to-air coverage remains relatively thin.

As for why acquiring this system was as "urgent" as the Jane's article suggests, let's just say that as things currently stand, a showdown is only a matter of time. Last September (as some of us recall) Syria's nuclear weapons program was forcefully brought to an end by an Israeli air strike. The Syrian air defense network is several times more dense than Iran's, and the Syrians never even knew the Israeli jets were coming. The Iranians no doubt see the writing on the wall.

Iran is sometimes hard to figure. Their government has a habit of bragging about every notional weapons system that they have a prototype for, but invests relatively little in real world weaponry. They remind me of the "Baghdad Bob" syndrome and his boasts of how Saddam was going to defeat the US and UK militaries.