SinoDefence Forum

GreatYuran

http://www.cnn.com/2005/US/12/06/mar...ash/index.html

I just read that article and near it end it states that the Harrier was capable of supersonic flight. I always thought it was subsonic though...

renmin

HUh? the Harrier only has a speed of 660 mph, thats sub sonic. 660 mph is the speed of the harrier II, were you talking about another version? as you know there are deferent variations of harriers by both Britain and America.

MIGleader

this is cnn bs. the only supersonic vtols are the yak-141 and the f-35(which is an stol). the harriers is a fifties design for go sake. in the fifites, they were still designing normal fighters to go supersonic.(exept the the f-86 was alredy out). no engine upgrad will work, since the airframe simply wasnt designed that way.

walter

I think the Harrier can go supersonic in a dive--doesn't make it a true supersonic aircraft by modern standards, though.

MadMax

the P.1154 was a devoloment of the harrier but it got cancled it used the same thrust vector system as the harrier but was larger and had the most powerful jet engine in the world at the time
here is a good article on it http://www.harrier.org.uk/history/history_p1154.htm

darth sidious

LOOK at the intake !!!!!!!! there is no way the puny harrier can be super sonic in level flight they are designed for LOW speed handling required for vertical take off

renmin

Well, first, the harrier is way too heavy with a weight of 13939lb when eympty, and 20552lb when loaded. In a sense, the harrier only has one engine. the airframe is symply too small to have any engine upgrades so it is quite impossible the harrier can reach super sonic speed.

GreatYuran

well CNN just changed it to near supersonic. i think they read our forum ^.^

crazyinsane105

I guess quite a few people read the mistake and sent CNN emails about it. And thank God the Harrier is being replaced. That plane has had the most accidents in the US inventory.

TerraN_EmpirE

the accidents are caused by a number of issues with the design. first the VTOL system often blows it's exhaust in to the intakes of the engine ( also happened to the XF32 ) this causes the engine to choke they call it a hiccup. second the controls are impossible to comprehend at times. harriers have a third major flaw they guzzle gas live there is no tomorrow

MIGleader

how can they talk about the harrier being well suited for marine missions when one just crashed in a patrol? i know the harrier can be a superb plane if used correctly, but this is just off subject!

bd popeye

You said it crazy. when I was stationed in the Philippines in '75-'77 the USMC lost 5 while I was there. The plane is great for what it was designed to do. but it's time has moved on...

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TerraN_EmpirE

A Harrier Can when used properly take out targets in 4 ways.
1 It's Gatling cannon
2 it's rockets
3 its missiles
4 it's VTOL thrusters.

the Aircraft is suited to marine operations in that it can deploy with the troops with out the need for a large Aircraft carrior. and be deployed in to the air faster then any convetional aircraft it's Vtol means it can land rearm and refuel in places that every thing but a helocoper could not do so. for it's advantages it's loaded with flaws made worse by Marine aviaters who Know how to master the craft being moved to inacticve as soon as they have.

The design flaws of the Herrier were taken in to acount with the F35.

Kampfwagen

I heard recently that the USMC might actualy get rid of the Harrier some time soon, probably replacing it with the J-35 Fighter. But they might replace it sooner than the J-35 arrives because of a recent incident where an AV8 II crashed into an Arizona Subburb. No-one was hurt but there was a lot of property damage. It was on MSNBC a few months ago. Aparently, from my understanding the AV8 family has been accident prone despite being an outstanding Air-To-Ground platform.

The_Zergling

http://www.pulitzer.org/year/2003/na...national2.html

I think it pretty much sums up most of the possible problems...