SinoDefence Forum

kliu0

This is very sad news. The problem lays with the lack of machinery (eg. excavators + helicopters). What I don't understand is why they would give up on digging into Siaolin Village, while I don't enjoy playing the blame game....one thing is clear from all this, the government can be partially blamed for the deaths, as their reactions was very slow. No state of emergency was declared, local governments were given responsibility of dealing with the typhoon and also only just today (7 days after) a national security conference was called. The military while already prepared for such an event before the typhoon was called in 2 days later.

There is also news that heavy helicopters requested by the Taiwanese government from the US and Japan will not arrive, as (quoted by MND minister) "they don't have the capability or some of them are too far away to help From this article: Foreign Helicopters To Aid Relief, MND: US, Japan Helicopters Too Far Away - Yahoo! News (Taiwan)

Reports that the soldiers stopped for 40 mins in order to welcome the defense minister and to take group pictures. Theres a picture included in the article. Link: Welcome Minister! Troops Stop For 40 Mins For Group Photo - Yahoo! News (Taiwan)

Air Force reports that all S-70 helicopters have been diverted to the rescue efforts. Link: All S-70C helicopters deployed for rescue work: Air Force - Taiwan News

bd popeye

CVN-73 was just in the Philippines. They have 12 SH-60 variants on board. And the USS Essex is in Okinawa..

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TheProfitt

is china sending in any rescue workers ? or equipment to help out ?.

or are they waiting for the taipai government to ask for help.

bd popeye

Welcome to our forum TheProfitt! Be sure to read the forum rules!

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As to your question. I don't think China has been asked or is planning on sending any help. That sort of action could trigger some sort of adverse action within China's borders.

I'd like to see the PLAN load up their lone LPD with 6 helos and head to the ROC to assist in the rescue efforts. But sadly that's not going to happen..

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kliu0

As I said, the MND minister said that...not me. I don't even think they asked, or if they did the US wouldn't help anyway. It would create some sort of situation if foreign troops (US, Japan) arrived in Taiwan, don't you think? I begin to feel that they've touched on the "line" of stupidity rather than their being politically correct, with that sort of decision. Its the decision thats going to cost more lives, if they did ask for help and earlier....we would've seen Siaolin Village being dug out now and possibly more survivors. I mean watching my countrymen die and suffer due to "politics" is just infuriating.

Now...further updates.

1. MORAKOT: THE AFTERMATH: Agricultural losses mount, exceed NT$11.1 billion - Taipei Times
2. MORAKOT: THE AFTERMATH: Official visits not welcomed by volunteers, victims - Taipei Times
3. MORAKOT: THE AFTERMATH: MOFA sends wish list to international community - Taipei TImes

bd popeye

More Typhoon Morakot relief effort photos from Taiwan. Unfortunately politics may be preventing other nations from getting involved in the relief effort.:-(

OUTSTANDING effort by the military of the Republic of China(Taiwan). OUTSTANDING.

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kliu0

Thanks For The Pictures, I'm uploading them on my blog and facebook to spread the word about donating if that's alright with you?

Some good news among the updates (especially no.1):
1. US Helicopters Rush To The Aid Of Taiwan - Liberty Times
2. Foreign aid pours in after Taiwan eases restrictions - Taipei Times
3. The long-term costs of Morakot - Taipei Times
4. Agricultural losses close to NT$11.8b - Taiwan News

bd popeye

Go for it! Those photos are not copyrighted and are avilable for public use.

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adeptitus

The ROCA and ROCN has over 100 transport/utility capable helicopters. I wish they were able to deploy them earlier, it'd be faster than asking for foreign aid. But the government was unwilling to deploy the military without a lot of planning, and that planning process was way too slow. Usually with disasters you have a very limited time to save people trapped in affected areas, before they succumb to the elements.

Another thing I noticed was that, during the initial disaster response, a lot of resources were used to send relief supplies to affected areas. I saw lunch boxes and loafs of bread being delivered to residents. These are easily perishable foods in Taiwan's hot weather.

Moving forward, I hope the government would encourage everyone to stock emergency rations and drinking water. If the residents would keep at least 1-2 weeks worth of emergency rations, it'd free up resources for the emergency response teams. Instead of delivering food and water, they could be saving lives and evacuating people elsewhere. I recall when I was young and living in TW, the government did encourage people to stock up some hard biscuits/cookies for emergency rations. But I don't see them for sale anymore.

Also, this would be controversial, but I think the government should not allow residents to rebuild mountain villages in dangerous mud-slide prone areas and river-bends. Funds should be allocated to assist the survivors to rebuild their homes elsewhere and assist them with housing and employment.

kliu0

As many reports have said, the vital 3 days are well over. It took 2 days to properly deploy the military, not to mention more than 7 days to accept foreign aid. The government is bungling up, one day we reject foreign aid, the other they accept. Requesting foreign governments donate imaginary helicopters that can carry 32 tons of weight is just plain ridiculous. The lack of co-ordination skills resulted in people losing lives.

Yes, they should rebuild elsewhere. But then again, as with every natural disaster, the government decides, not the people. It might also be "unfeasible" to build closer to the cities. I remember seeing an article about "unfeasibility" for the typhoon, the efforts to dig up Siaolin Village was halted...as it was unfeasible. And that was within the first few days, when people's lives could've been saved.

While they don't make those sort of rations anymore, you can find those MREs (Meal, Ready-to-Eat) available around military bases, the supplies stores sells them. Another factor is that the government didn't tell anyone to stock up given that the Weather Bureau predicted things completely wrong.

Given that Taiwan experiences many typhoons, I'm appalled at the government reaction, and the lack of willingness to upgrade existing infrastructure which has failed to keep up with modernisation efforts. I clearly remember it was last September, when I was back in Taiwan where there was a typhoon which killed a few people and destroyed several bridges. It's just plain weird and controversial, why the government didn't bother typhoon-proofing or better protecting the infrastructure and to ensure there is better response teams.

SteelBird

According to the news I've watched so far, China is planning to send two Mil-26 giant helos to Taiwan. A moment before, the news confirmed that two US helos will arrive this afternoon at 2 o'clock Taiwan's time.

kliu0

China wants to send, but Taiwan has rejected it. Taiwan has only accepted the money, disinfectants, sleeping bags and 1000 pre-fabricated houses.

The MND confirmed that the US is sending CH-53E Super Stallions via Amphibious Transport Dock and that they will arrive tomorrow. So far only a USAF C-130 has arrived to deliver supplies at around 2pm in Taiwan time, at a ROCAF base in Tainan.

adeptitus

Besides typhoons, there's earthquakes, mud slides, flooding, etc. I don't think the government should only tell people to stock up on emergency supplies right before a typhoon. People should be encouraged to keep emergency supplies year-round. Perhaps the government could set standards in emergency rations (quality, packaging, and shelf life) and encourage domestic industry to produce them.

Building dams and protective barriers give people a false sense of security. They're only effective up to a certain point against mother nature. We learned that the hard way with Hurricane Katrina.

SteelBird

I learned from Wiki that China operates only two Mi-26 which can carry up to 20 tons of cargo. If China is willing to send two of them together to Taiwan, it's a very good will of them. As for Taiwan, I think they have very good reason to reject it because their political relations are too sensitive and it might cause political debate in the island which would be another chaos beside the natural disaster.

kliu0

Not only the political reasons. Look at the military reasons, from a military point of view, it should not even be considered. Symbolically, if China sends in PLA helicopters it would send a ripple throughout Taiwan's armed forces, even if its peaceful. National security issues, with regard to Taiwan terrain, location of military bases and equipment (especially hidden ones) would have a higher chance of being discovered. While of course China already sees alot from satellites, but the naked eye is always better.