New Type98/99 MBT thread

[ger_mark]

Originally Posted by MIGleader

ok aluka. we got the last type 99 thread closed because u kept argueing it was t-72 copy. so lets avoid the t-72 entirely. the mtu881 ebngine is a really powerfu and reliable engine, quality ukrainian engineering. i wouldnt be surprised if it the wd396 was based off it, but copied?
no.

i though the type 98g was the type 99...

mtu is german, not ukrainian

[MIGleader]

Originally Posted by ger_mark

mtu is german, not ukrainian

sry, iwas thinking of the GTD-1250.
if its a german engine...maybe so. but i highly doubt the chinese use gas turbine in 99. a diesel is more reliable, proven, easier to use, and fuel effecient.

[ger_mark]

the mtu 881 is no gas turbine but a diesel engine
same used in pzh 2000

[Aluka]

ok aluka. we got the last type 99 thread closed because u kept argueing it was t-72 copy. so lets avoid the t-72 entirely.

The thread in which i claimed ZTZ-99 to be based on T-72M was not closed, the old forum was. Anyway, it's obvious - the design is generally similar and it has the same kind of autoloader, so driver should feel pretty much similar.

As for the new type - i suspect that old-looking ZTZ-99 were actually upgraded ZTZ-98, and new ones were built recently. I've done some surfing through baidu and found couple more pictures:




The look of the turret's rear accidentally brought another idea - it doesn't seem to have case extraction hatch, so probably this new tank has T-80-style or even some new autoloader.


Oh, and yes, MTU881 is german.

[MIGleader]

Originally Posted by ger_mark

the mtu 881 is no gas turbine but a diesel engine
same used in pzh 2000

im talking about the gtd-2500...for a certain someone who thinks everything in the type 99 is ripped off the t-72...

[Aluka]

There is no such thing as GTD-2500, the latest one is GTD-1500, and GTD-2000 is under development. Anyway, nobody produces GTD engines except Russia, not even Ukraine, so what was the point of it? WD396 is definitely a diesel engine.

[MIGleader]

Originally Posted by Aluka

There is no such thing as GTD-2500, the latest one is GTD-1500, and GTD-2000 is under development. Anyway, nobody produces GTD engines except Russia, not even Ukraine, so what was the point of it? WD396 is definitely a diesel engine.

sry, gtd-1250. i definitly believe ukrain greatly assisted the development of the engine.

[Aluka]

Nope. Not even a bit. The engine is 100% russian, furthermore, they tried to force Ukraine to produce it, but they didn't agree.

[swimmerXC]

ARE YOU GUYS TRYING TO GET MORE POSTS WITH ONELINERS?

[Aluka]

A theory...


But why would they need to replace one welded turret construction with another, especially considering the fact that armor blocks remain same (judging by their size)? What if these ZTZ-99 tanks were simply produced at the other plant?

[MIGleader]

Originally Posted by Aluka

A theory...


But why would they need to replace one welded turret construction with another, especially considering the fact that armor blocks remain same (judging by their size)? What if these ZTZ-99 tanks were simply produced at the other plant?

cause the arnmor on the original type 98 was not strong enough, it was merely a permanent block of composite armor on the turret, much like the type 96. when the type 99 came out in 02, it replaced the single composite block with several modules that could be either era or an improved composite, for greater flexibility and protection.

btw, does anyone know how many production lines there are for the type 99?

[Vytautas]

Im not sure that this turret is new.Apart from some minor changes everything is the same.As for the sloped front of the turret if you look closer then you will see that all that is different are some sloped armor blocks attached.(as on those modernised british centurion tanks in service with the idf)

[Aluka]

cause the arnmor on the original type 98 was not strong enough, it was merely a permanent block of composite armor on the turret, much like the type 96. when the type 99 came out in 02, it replaced the single composite block with several modules that could be either era or an improved composite, for greater flexibility and protection.

You didn't get my point. I didn't mention ERA blocks, and i did not compare ZTZ-98 to ZTZ-99, but oldZTZ-99 to newZTZ-99 instead (assuming that the main difference between 98 and 99 is ERA). The rear construction of the turret was changed to type90-style. Composite blocks most likely remained same. And by the way, physical thickness of type98 armor is somewhat 1.3*thickness of type96 armor.

As for the sloped front of the turret if you look closer then you will see that all that is different are some sloped armor blocks attached

Probably the've realised - the bigger ERA block is, the better it reacts against sabot.

[MIGleader]

some updates.
http://www.sinodefence.com/army/tank/type98.asp
read aluka!!! is it still a t-72 copy?

dongfeng, can u clarify:
what are the exact systems of the type-99s new BMS(battle management system), and how do they work and perform? there was a discussion about this, and I didnt know the type 99 didnt have a BMS til now.

theres also a claim that the type 99 has improved firepower over the type 98, how? i thought they used the same gun.

[Bohemond]

I know some were arguing that the Abrams is not as good as the Americans say it is, but I am not to sure, it can be knocked out, yes, but it is easily repaired and back in action, and crew survivability is fantastic(The abrams knocked out in desert storm was shot from a short distance and in the side and the round didnt penetrate completely, and the crew survived...) . Dont forget also that the LeClerc, Leopard, and the Challenger are all similarly as good...Im not sure if this tank compares to any of those.

Also it probably has an autoloader, which is a bad idea, a average Abrams crew can get off a shot every 4 seconds, some even at 2 seconds apart. Average autoloader is 8 seconds.

Also you must not forget that no matter how good the equipment...how good are the people using it, how experienced and well trained are the commanders ect...

Any army that is lesser in equipment quality and greater in skill and morale will win, look at history, especially Israel.