Chinese Marines: How many can they land in a day?

[Issa]

How many men? I heard they can't land any more than 1900, but I got that info from propaganda sources (GlobalSecurity and FAS). I want to know what Chinese people think. Perhaps you could shed some light in the face of all of this Western propaganda?

Regards,

Issa

[President]

land where? land taiwan? half day will above 50000, i am pretty sure. land US? impossible. land Iran? probably never do that. :p :p :p :p

[Issa]

Well, Taiwan is a bit too close. :D Let's say, just for the sake of discussion, India.

[vincelee]

none. They have to contest with the Indian Eastern Fleet in it's home territory, which means the PLAN loses.

[Jeff Head]

How many men? I heard they can't land any more than 1900.

They have enough capability to carry a lot more than that. Check out this site :

PLAN AMPHIB vs USN AMPHIB Capabilities (http://www.jeffhead.com/redseadragon/amphib.htm)

Do the math.

They have the sea lift capability to do a couple of divisions or more...but whether they could project that with sufficient force to allow it to land under conditions where it was militarily contested is another question entirely.

My answer is...not yet.

[bd popeye]

They have enough capability to carry a lot more than that. Check out this site :

PLAN AMPHIB vs USN AMPHIB Capabilities (http://www.jeffhead.com/redseadragon/amphib.htm)

Do the math.

They have the sea lift capability to do a couple of divisions or more...but whether they could project that with sufficient force to allow it to land under conditions where it was militarily contested is another question entirely.

My answer is...not yet.

Jeff I agree..Not yet. While the PLAN has plenty of landing craft they don't have the necessary suppourt vessels. I.E. and LPH/LHA type ships with attack helos and or fixed wing aircraft for air cover and ground suppourt.

Jeff, according to the USN they have 91 LCAC's not 54 as you sighted on your page.

http://www.navy.mil/navydata/fact_display.asp?cid=4200&tid=1500&ct=4

Issa, I can understand your dislike of FAS. But global security? They are pretty accurate about the strenght of US forces. As for PLA forces they can only publish the information that the PLA releases..which is very little. I wish the PLA would release more.

I would like to know what information about the USN you think global security has that is propaganda? Thank you!

[FreeAsia2000]

Issa, I can understand your dislike of FAS. But global security? They are pretty accurate about the strenght of US forces. As for PLA forces they can only publish the information that the PLA releases..which is very little. I wish the PLA would release more.

I would like to know what information about the USN you think global security has that is propaganda? Thank you!

I asked this question as well because I thought globalsecurity sometimes lay it on a bit thick and was told that they were set up by an ex-FAS member

[bd popeye]

I asked this question as well because I thought globalsecurity sometimes lay it on a bit thick and was told that they were set up by an ex-FAS member

I don't know about the info on global security about other nations but the info they post about the US forces, USN in particular, is pretty accurate. As for them being set up by a former FAS member :eek: I never heard that. :confused: Makes you wonder.

One last thing. I can verfiy a lot of tech info about the USN through people I know still on active duty.

[Liberator]

none. They have to contest with the Indian Eastern Fleet in it's home territory, which means the PLAN loses.

Any sientific proof and source? If so, please list them by clicking on the REPLY button on this thread.

---

Vincelee, you got warned by the staff.

[MIGleader]

well, in a war with india, it would be mear indo china, not on anyones backyard. the pla has the ability to land currently 50,000 troops, and at least 10000 marines near taiwan strait are always ready. dont for get airdrops, heli insertion, and infilitration are means of landing aswell.

[Issa]

bd popeye, FAS and GlobalSecurity are pretty much the same thing. In fact, many of their articles are identicle to each other word for word.

[adeptitus]

How many men? I heard they can't land any more than 1900, but I got that info from propaganda sources (GlobalSecurity and FAS). I want to know what Chinese people think. Perhaps you could shed some light in the face of all of this Western propaganda?
Regards,
Issa

You're going to get a wide range of different numbers.

Someone who wants to exaggerate would cite maximum numbers based on troop transport capability. If you look at the "capacity" of a landing ship, it'd say something like:

"200 troops, or 5 tanks, or 10 vehicles, or 500 tons of cargo beaching"

Realistically you cannot count every ship to be carrying maximum # of troops in an amphibious invasion. The troops need tanks, APC's, artillery, heavy equipment, trucks, ammo, food, etc. Unless if you're invading Somolia against militia armed with Ak-47's only.

As for India, why go all the way by ship when you can send the troops over by land?

[Issa]

It was a hypothetical scenario. I did not state this implying it was realistic or even possible.

[President]

you guys forget one thing to take into account, in war time, PLA are able and free to commandeered civilian property for landing just as they did in flood time. PLA sunk lots of large civilian ships and trucks in Yangzi rive to block flood, government will compenstate for it. commandeered civilian propert for war is a tradition of PLA so called people's war. :D

[MIGleader]

so the pla should comandeer the chinese ecnonmy and use it to sukerpunck taiwan if necassery.

[Jeff Head]

according to the USN they have 91 LCAC's not 54 as you sighted on your page.

Thanks...I will update the numbers today!

[bd popeye]

you guys forget one thing to take into account, in war time, PLA are able and free to commandeered civilian property for landing just as they did in flood time.

So..The PLA could use "any means possible" to invade Tiawan or conduct any other military operation? You know If I was in the PLA and had to cross the strait in some ferry or other civillan ship I would not feel as secure as I would in a real Amphibous ship. Afterall the civillan ships are not equipped for such a task. And there water tight integrity justs sucks. Which makes for easy sinking.

[Totoro]

I don't believe commmercial sealift resources would seriously be used in any kind of amphibious assault/landing. After a beachhead has been secured/a port been occupied and put to use, yeah. But not before that, certainly not when enemy is still shooting at you. Alternatively, some of the commercial fleet could be used as decoys and/or cannon fodder.

[bd popeye]

Totoro sez..""Alternatively, some of the commercial fleet could be used as decoys and/or cannon fodder"".

Like I said I would not wanna be a PLA soilder in that case. But of course some of those ships will just be decoys....I think...

[MIGleader]

the chinese can make a portable ciws, any ship becomes lethal. maybe they will make a decoy fleet of civil ships like the allies di in normandy.

[Jeff Head]

I think...

Lots of commercial vessels were used at Dunkirk and they were under fire and yet performed herocially.

Of course, they were evacuating, not assaulting.

My guess is that the PLAN will use a lot of commerical vessles in an attempt against Tawian, but not in the first waves. They will use there military sea lift and air assault for that.

[BrotherofSnake]

lol, a portable CIWS is impractical. We armed M113 with 20mm cannons and they failed horribly. It could not hold enough ammunition and it could not work in night time operations.

http://www.fas.org/man/dod-101/sys/land/m163.htm

[MIGleader]

civil vessels can send reinforcements and supplies, to keep the invasion a 24/7 operation.

[Jeff Head]

Yes they can...and they can land third and fourth echelon troops if the beaches are secured.

...and therein lies the key.

It will always all depend on what level and how effectively the landings are contested in the air, on land and sea.

[swimmerXC]

lol, a portable CIWS is impractical. We armed M113 with 20mm cannons and they failed horribly. It could not hold enough ammunition and it could not work in night time operations.

http://www.fas.org/man/dod-101/sys/land/m163.htm

did you see the land based CIWS?? put that on a LST and you got a protable CIWS :)

[MIGleader]

just what i was thinking...and put a yitian on the ship two.

[Lavi]

The number of people PLAN can land is to much depending on the scenario to be given exact. If we take Taiwan as an example, the main problem is the number of defenders their weapons, will the invasion fleet be met by air attacks when our on the sea already, how many hostile naval vessels will be in the area?

For a trip to India the problem of resupply is added, the troops will have to eat and drink during the journey, and the ships will have to be refuelled. Add this to the problems stated above and you have the main problems PLAN would face.

For a first wave, actually assaulting the beaches, PLAN has a quite limited capability, because of its lack of ships able to protect and support the landings, not its lack of landing tonnage. In the waves following up, when some kind of a beachead has already been established, China would be able to land much more soldiers and equipment in each wave. Here civilan ships could also be used with success.

Making a surprise attack would mean that they were not (as much) hampered by the lack of fire support and protection, but the preparations for such a attack would probably not be possible to hide for the intelligence service of the intended target.