WZ-10 thread

[planeman]

What type of P&W engines are they? - it is useful info to have to gauge its capabilities.

[tphuang]

Originally Posted by planeman

What type of P&W engines are they? - it is useful info to have to gauge its capabilities.

if you read the article, it says that WZ-10 is getting 50 PT6B-67C and Z-8F is getting 50 PT6B-67A. Actually, it said that they are getting at least that many. The final sum is not mentionned at the moment. It's worth noting that the first few WZ-10 may not have been using 67C as the engine or at least that's what I remember Kanwa said about what P&W exported to China.

I guess Z-8F is getting into service to then from the look of this.

Speaking of which, they had some photos of new Z-8 going into service.

[Deino]

... and another one !



Deino

[KYli]

Originally Posted by Gollevainen

neither did I, but i sure did doupt most of the pics labeld "WZ-10". The most covincing proof to me is that this new pic and the two others (one with the J-11 alongside) are all about the same plane...

Me, too. There are so many PS, that few of the more reliable pictures seem also unconvincible. But lately WZ10 pics have been appearing in Chinese forum more often, I am hoping there would be more close up photo to confirm what exactly WZ10 look like.

[chicket9]

Well the PLA seems to be acquiring WZ-9Gs faster than acquiring normal Z-9s, so it appears that PLA are pretty interested in the attack helicopter thing.

20 sounds reasonable for preproduction run and evaluation. But gosh, why depend on foreign engines so much, wish Chinese aero industry would one day make its own comparable engines, will make logistics much easier and you can build aircraft whenever u want rather than waiting for foreign engines to come. I mean 50 engines, god the WZ-10 uses 2 already, and u gotta save some for spares...

I'd expect around 100 to be procured...won't be a huge number since China will not face another land invasion, and might export this baby in the future...perhaps a future candidate to replace Pakistan and Iran's AH-1s. As for a naval variant, i highly doubt it until PLAN operates a decent sized LPD or helicopter carrier. It would be an excellent counter to Taiwan's small missile boats though.

Its good that the WZ-10 appears to feature some stealthy design characteristics...unlike the chunky looking Russian choppers.

[Kampfwagen]

Originally Posted by renmin

I know this is a bit off topic but did you guys realize that the real WZ10 looks nothing like the WZ10 in Battlefield 2?

Oh well, you can't always be accurate.

You have to remember, the WZ-10 was moddled after a few probably fake images and hear-say. So considering they got it that accurate, I find that pretty damn close.

They probably want the forigen engines because they want a springboard to compare to in order to later make their own helicopter engines. After all, practicaly all of the PLA's Helicopter Fleet are forgien aircraft, modified for their use. (Mi-17, Super Puma, Dauphin II, Ka-28 ((correct if incorrect)) etc.)

[big toothbrush]

[Sczepan]

http://tuku.military.china.com/milit...71-1036_1.html

[ger_mark]

Originally Posted by Sczepan

http://tuku.military.china.com/milit...71-1036_1.html

Germany now involved in WZ10 programme?

[maozedong]

mr.Tphuang:
are you sure those engine(pt6b-67c) really use at WZ10? do you think UsA not to stop the sale?I think china is able to make this kind of the engine, however Wz10 is only mid size of the helicopter,china is not the first time to make helicopters,I think the difficulty to make Wz10 is digital armed fire,radar,air to ground missile(advence),Mr.PKF usly like to make news for china,do you think so?

[tphuang]

Originally Posted by maozedong

mr.Tphuang:
are you sure those engine(pt6b-67c) really use at WZ10? do you think UsA not to stop the sale?I think china is able to make this kind of the engine, however Wz10 is only mid size of the helicopter,china is not the first time to make helicopters,I think the difficulty to make Wz10 is digital armed fire,radar,air to ground missile(advence),Mr.PKF usly like to make news for china,do you think so?

WZ-10 at the initial batch is definitely not using indigenous engine. In a later production run, it might or might not. Here is the deal, China has been getting components from the west whenever it can. It seems helicopter is one area where China can get away from the Arms embargo. As for USA not stopping the sale? Well, you have to realize that China is importing them from P&W CANADA, where the export regulation is no where near as strong. In fact, even the y-8F600 are using P&W Canada engines.

If you can use the superior and more reliable P&W engines, why would you want to use the Chinese ones?

[challenge]

Originally Posted by planeman

Great, this latest pic is entirely consistent with the previous two most-credible ones:
http://www.sinodefenceforum.com/atta...6&d=1141411623
http://www.sinodefenceforum.com/atta...7&d=1141411623


And my artist’s impression was very close (Whoopee for me!):
http://i2.tinypic.com/vcqrg6.jpg

according to 2003 back issue of Flight international.vibration test for Chinese helicopter,the Civilian Z-10 and WZ-10 were carry out in Augusta reserach facility,in italy.in fact drawing of both Z-10 and WZ-10 were identical to small prototype display in the last Zhuhai airshow and WZ-10 that appear in the website.
detail first appear in taiwanese Defense magazine.the original blue print come from French,but did not include any technical assistant.therefore Chinese engineers like the israeli using stolen Mirage-3 jet blue print ,which eventually become kfir,has to start from ground up.
Chinese engineers may use different engine such MTU turbine,speculate it may also included russian engine.

[tphuang]

Originally Posted by challenge

according to 2003 back issue of Flight international.vibration test for Chinese helicopter,the Civilian Z-10 and WZ-10 were carry out in Augusta reserach facility,in italy.in fact drawing of both Z-10 and WZ-10 were identical to small prototype display in the last Zhuhai airshow and WZ-10 that appear in the website.
detail first appear in taiwanese Defense magazine.the original blue print come from French,but did not include any technical assistant.therefore Chinese engineers like the israeli using stolen Mirage-3 jet blue print ,which eventually become kfir,has to start from ground up.
Chinese engineers may use different engine such MTU turbine,speculate it may also included russian engine.

I really have no idea what you are talking about here. You are making a lot of claim and the stuff about Russian engine is the first time that I've ever heard of it.

[maozedong]

Wz10 is a fighting helicopter,the so call"third generation"copter,that needs the copter has hight quality of fighting reactions,lower area of the sky patrol,even very close to the ground,hiding attack,for these function,it require the copter has hight quality and special body design,it also needs the engine must compatible to the copter's body,it may needs special designed engine,the regular civilian copter engine supppose can not incorporat into Wz10 copter.
I think if china wants import engine from other countrys,the country suppose to be chinese military partner,very closed relataion,some times china have to provide Wz10' standar data to the country,let their engineer to design a suitable engine for Wz10.
china have many kind of helicopters,include US made BLACKHAWK copter,so,this time china import canadian engins may not be used at Wz10.
we never forget the story of canada military helicopters,if china use these civilian engines at Wz10, then you may imagine how the quality of Wz10.
another exsample for this opinion,when china use russia engine for J10 airfighters,they want russia improved the Al30fn engines to incorporate into J10fighters,then russia to do so,the cleared only militarypartner like russia can do this.
in 80' century,most western countrys were china' militarypartner,they attent many military projects,but not now aney more.although some Europe countrys would like to be a partner of china-like France,but they are in the bondge of the article,as sofar as we know,France and china will corporate to make Z15,but that is only civilian helicopter,or improve to a generl military use copter,it deffint than Wz10.
we must note that chinese officer denyed Pt6b-67c is use at Wz10,we should belive this,they don't have to telling lie,they might not to say "yes" or "no".
aneyway,china is a quite well credit country in the world.

[tphuang]

Originally Posted by maozedong

Wz10 is a fighting helicopter,the so call"third generation"copter,that needs the copter has hight quality of fighting reactions,lower area of the sky patrol,even very close to the ground,hiding attack,for these function,it require the copter has hight quality and special body design,it also needs the engine must compatible to the copter's body,it may needs special designed engine,the regular civilian copter engine supppose can not incorporat into Wz10 copter.
I think if china wants import engine from other countrys,the country suppose to be chinese military partner,very closed relataion,some times china have to provide Wz10' standar data to the country,let their engineer to design a suitable engine for Wz10.

The engine China bought is not a custom one like AL-31FN. As for WZ-10 data, you do realize that China got help from both Agusta and Eurocopter on the project right? So, basically these companies should know at least part of WZ-10's data and interior design, if not a lot more.

china have many kind of helicopters,include US made BLACKHAWK copter,so,this time china import canadian engins may not be used at Wz10.
we never forget the story of canada military helicopters,if china use these civilian engines at Wz10, then you may imagine how the quality of Wz10.
another exsample for this opinion,when china use russia engine for J10 airfighters,they want russia improved the Al30fn engines to incorporate into J10fighters,then russia to do so,the cleared only militarypartner like russia can do this.

Blackhawks and Pt6b-67c? Do you seriously think you can just put any engine on a helicopter. Check it, they are two different weight classes.
P&W engines are far more reliable than the Russian engines.

in 80' century,most western countrys were china' militarypartner,they attent many military projects,but not now aney more.although some Europe countrys would like to be a partner of china-like France,but they are in the bondge of the article,as sofar as we know,France and china will corporate to make Z15,but that is only civilian helicopter,or improve to a generl military use copter,it deffint than Wz10.

You seriously don't think Z-15 will end up in the military? You do realize that EC-120 is in PLA right now, right?

we must note that chinese officer denyed Pt6b-67c is use at Wz10,we should belive this,they don't have to telling lie,they might not to say "yes" or "no".
aneyway,china is a quite well credit courantry in the world.

Chinese officials lie to people's face sometimes. For example, you should read the JDW article on Y-8F600/Y-9. Are you serious about some of these stuff that you are writing?