WZ-10 thread

**Red Guard** · 03-02-2006, 12:35 AM

you didn't see it, i didn't post it.

**backwindow** · 03-02-2006, 01:14 AM

Is that a tiger? It's uncommon the helo get so close when a fighter take off.

**xihaoli** · 03-02-2006, 01:30 AM

Hmm....I don't know, it seems like a psed apache.

1) The tailwind from the helo has absolutely no afffect on the nearby trees.

2) There is no signs of heat coming from the engines, both for the "wz-10"
and the flanker (or is that a j-11b?)

3) The color scheme is inconsistent, if your look closely you can see that the
tail has some kind of redish glow to it.

4) This pic contradicts many of the cgi pics out there, the engine seems
englarged and the chain gun looks....familiar....seems too small to be a 25- 30mm, and i dont think the Plaaf have any lower calibor cannons....

5) Notice the blurry outline of the background behind the "wz-10," the water tower and the tree line is blurry, yet the wz-10 appears to be better quality then the j-11. From eyeing it the distance looks to be 100-300 yards?

6) Where are the ground crew? It's not like the wz-10's going to travel far.....
Remember..."it dosen't exist"

Btw what is your source? I'm more interested in the flanker. Does anyone know if its a prototype of a j-11 variant? I also dont that that the "hump" behind the cockpit is normal.......I believe the standard color for prototypes is yellow?

Where is this??? And how the hell do people get this close to a military airfield testing for "aircrafts that do not exist."

Im probrably just a skeptic, but until some further proof comes, im going to go with that its a ps.....

If i was taking pictures... i would definitely get more thne one pic.....

**icy_CMU** · 03-02-2006, 06:44 AM

This is real PSed WZ-10

.

**Kampfwagen** · 03-02-2006, 07:24 AM

The 'Wz-10' is PS'ed, no doubt. However, I dont blame you for trying. Finding real photos of the aircraft is very dificult. I dont suspect you for making it, but it is clearly a photoshop.

The most obvious thing is that typicaly they dont make flights like this when a jet is taking off. It is just too dangerous to have two aircraft flying in such close a manner as these two are. It's probably a PS'ed EU Tiger.

But the airplane looks real. It is dificult to see, but there is a heat trail coming from it (you can see the wavering heat-lines. Though this, admitedly can be photoshoped as well). It is just that the engines arent obviously generating any heat, which is bizzare...

**Deino** · 03-02-2006, 08:11 AM

I don't think it's a PS ... even if I agree with these "strage" circumstances "Two prototypes at the same time" ... what a jack-pot !

But I would follow crobato's aguments posted at the CDF:

Originally Posted by crobato

I decided to take a close look at the picture, subjecting it high magnifications.

Sorry no, its not a PS. You can see just right under the WZ-10 there is background blur from produced by the heat and winds produced by the helo. The weapons are too low res to be cut and paste and the pixel jaggies are consistent with the rest of the picture.

There are also blurs caused by the heat of the J-11's engine's just right at the back of the nozzle. Oddly enough there is the tail of a third aircraft whose body is obscured by the thermal blur.

Ohhh ... these are so interesting and exciting times ....

Deino

**KYli** · 03-02-2006, 10:21 AM

If it is a PS, i would say this is a good one. It could fool a lot of people out here, including me.

**crobato** · 03-02-2006, 11:18 AM

The picture is taken with a telephoto. There is actually some distance between the helicopter and the plane. But because of the telephoto distortion, the perspective looks flattened and everything seems much closer than they actually were.

The J-11 has a shadow on the ground.

All the lighting is consistent in one direction, including the Z-10. Note the radar dome behind the J-11. You can see from its highlight and shadow the direction of the light source.

In addition to the thermal blur underneath the Z-10, you can see the ground being kicked up by the wind of the rotor blades. Look at the ground underneath the Z-10 and compare to the ground to the right and front of the J-11. If you use photoshop and remove the Z-10 from the picture, it becomes more obvious from the effects of the ground that something was supposed to be hovering over the area where there is wind blur.

**renmin** · 03-02-2006, 12:19 PM

Nope not a apache, apaches do not have stacked up cockpits, they are connected in a AH-64. That does not look like a tiger either, only the cockpit looks sorta like a tiger. Anyway this looks too much like it has been photo shoped. The scale between the flanker and helicopter are totally wrong. I doubt this is real. That flanker could be a new made J-11, Before new made J-11s enter service, they are painted in the color in the picture.

**ger_mark** · 03-02-2006, 03:43 PM

Could have been a credible PS (like the one on sinodefence) but the J-11B with WS-10 Engine on the same picture aswell is just more then luck for the guy who tooked that picture

**crobato** · 03-02-2006, 07:37 PM

The scale between the flanker and helicopter are totally wrong. I doubt this is real.

Scales change because of the focal length of the lens used. Looking at the background of the picture, this appears to be a telephoto lens and telephoto lenses distort the perspective and make everything look flat by removing picture depth.

That flanker could be a new made J-11, Before new made J-11s enter service, they are painted in the color in the picture.

The pics of the newly made J-11's I've seen show the planes with a combination of their blue grey body color and yellow patches. Why this one is quite different is because the nose is all black, and the tail tips and forward edges are black too. None of the J-11s are like that; their nose for exemple, has a lighter grey color compared to the Russian built, and they always have that stylistic cutout shape underneath. This is not your standard J-11.

If you look at the J-10s, some of the prototypes are in yellow color. The FC-1 prototype was also in yellow before they were repainted.

Could have been a credible PS (like the one on sinodefence) but the J-11B with WS-10 Engine on the same picture aswell is just more then luck for the guy who tooked that picture

It's more than just luck. There is a place in China where you have all the prototypes are placed together in one base. When I mean all prototypes, I mean all prototypes, this iincludes JH-7A prototypes, J-8 prototypes, the Y-8 AWACS prototypes, Y-8 radar test beds, H-6X prototypes. This place is the CFTE or China Flight Test Establishment located in Xian. The background seems to support that this is the CFTE.

http://www.china-military.org/units/acft/cfte/cfte.htm

Among the prototypes previously tested here is a J-11 with the WS-10A engines. To have a yellow J-11 in that base, it is definitely not your standard J-11.

**Red not Dead** · 03-02-2006, 07:55 PM

Hum it's the same Eurocopter we've been offered as TEH REAL WZ for months now. Get over it it is positively not a WZ 10.

**crobato** · 03-02-2006, 09:30 PM

Originally Posted by Red not Dead

Hum it's the same Eurocopter we've been offered as TEH REAL WZ for months now. Get over it it is positively not a WZ 10.

Why don't you actually take a look at some Eurocopter Tigers.

http://www.eurocopter.com/site/FO/sc...ue=&affiche=1#

Notice that the Tiger has its canopy staggered, but the WZ-10 does not. While the two are similar, there are some changes like the rear wheel and fin.

Compare the picture of the helo with the J-11 to this pic from Hui Tong, which is another WZ-10

http://mil.jschina.com.cn/huitong/helo/Z-10c.jpg

It's exactly with the two.

It's already assumed that the WZ-10 is heavily European inspired, given that the PRC looks up to the Europeans for their helo inspirations and not the Russians, and it is no surprise it looks a lot like a Eurocopter given the big business Eurocopter has in China. But it's always the details that tell you it's still not a real Eurocopter.