New JF-17/FC-1 Fighter Aircraft thread

[Aliph Ahmed]

Pilot head in the latest JF-17 has been replaced by a Rotary Multifunctional Probe. This new probe was produced by Chinese Department of Comprehensive Planning Department, China Aero Products Division, and Department of airborne equipment and technology development and in consultation with French company Thales.

The new probe replaces the traditional fuselage pitot head to measure the the angle of attack. The new generation of sensors will now detect both the atmospheric data and aircraft's angle of attack. This will make it very easy for the pilot to follow and understand the data reflected by a MFD. It is a major step forward in acquiring the latest technologies and their integration in our JF-17.

Source: Pshamim at www.pakdef.info

This is in the same class of technology that is found on latest block 60 F-16s.

[bd popeye]

Don't make a fool of yourself by claiming those are PS. As what Crobato mention,this is the usual routine for PLAAF testing out new plane......

Young man I have 20 years of actual military experience to judge these photos by. In my trained military eye I do not see a reason for a brand new aircraft fresh out of the factory to have weapons loaded on them.

If this is indeed how the PLAAF test it's aircraft. So be it. I find it unusal.

Let me rephrase that again. It's not for testing. Its because the plane's aerodynamics and flight control systems are optimized against a configuration with the plane having two missiles, instead of none.

I understand. Much like an F-18 always seem to have sidewinders mounted on the wing tips.

[Ryz05]

Originally Posted by crobato

Let me rephrase that again. It's not for testing. Its because the plane's aerodynamics and flight control systems are optimized against a configuration with the plane having two missiles, instead of none.

It sounds unusual but this is how the F-16 was designed. These planes fly better with the two AAMs than without them.

That makes sense - that they are optimising JF-17 to fly with two AAMS, since it is designed to be a fighter jet afterall. Carrying missiles on its wings is not unusual.

Originally Posted by Aliph Ahmed

Pilot head in the latest JF-17 has been replaced by a Rotary Multifunctional Probe. This new probe was produced by Chinese Department of Comprehensive Planning Department, China Aero Products Division, and Department of airborne equipment and technology development and in consultation with French company Thales.

The new probe replaces the traditional fuselage pitot head to measure the the angle of attack. The new generation of sensors will now detect both the atmospheric data and aircraft's angle of attack. This will make it very easy for the pilot to follow and understand the data reflected by a MFD. It is a major step forward in acquiring the latest technologies and their integration in our JF-17.

Source: Pshamim at www.pakdef.info

This is in the same class of technology that is found on latest block 60 F-16s.

So you are saying the FC-1 is now comparable to the latest F-16 models? While the J-7G is comparable to earlier f-16 models? It seems like the PLAAF is continuously improving the FC-1, so maybe it will be equipped by the air force afterall.

[eecsmaster]

I don't think anyone except you has tossed the J-7G and the F-16A into the same category. They're not the same, and are not comparable. In fact, the LFX program wanted a fighter that can counter the MiG-21. So stop saying what's obviously false, over and over.

[Aliph Ahmed]

Originally Posted by eecsmaster

I don't think anyone except you has tossed the J-7G and the F-16A into the same category. They're not the same, and are not comparable. In fact, the LFX program wanted a fighter that can counter the MiG-21. So stop saying what's obviously false, over and over.

Little things exhilarate little minds. This is EXACTLY why I didnt bother replying to Ryz05.

[Ryz05]

Originally Posted by eecsmaster

I don't think anyone except you has tossed the J-7G and the F-16A into the same category. They're not the same, and are not comparable. In fact, the LFX program wanted a fighter that can counter the MiG-21. So stop saying what's obviously false, over and over.

I got the comparison between the J-7G and the F-16 previously on sinodefence. It also makes sense for the backbone of the PLAAF to be something on level with the F-16. Why then, would they keep on producing the J-7G only when more advanced fighters like J-10 and J-11 come online as opposed to replacing it with the JF-17? The J-7G might not be as capable in ground-attack capabilities, but it certainly is as lethal in close quarter combat as the F-16. The newest multirole J-8 models would certainly be more advanced than the J-7G and early models of F-16, which would explain the delay in JF-17 induction.

ahmed,
If you have nothing more constructive to say, don't bother writing anything.

[sanwal]

Not a perfect pic for comparison but here it is.

[Gollevainen]

Why is it, that you guys are just not able to discuss civilized over JF-17???
How come such a small plane rises so much emotions that you need to start bashing each others?

Someone raised the question: "Why is china are still producing planes that has been obsolent since last few decades?" Well thats very fundamental question and to find awnser to it makes you understand the overall capability of china as military producer much better. It puts all the current chinese programs in to new perspective once you have understood what happened in the past.

I know the anwser, or quite few of them actually and I'm pretty sure most of the members that actually understand even the very basics of military knows it as well (tough few have sometimes bit hard to accept it ) But as a nasty teacher I wont spoil your satisfaction to seek it out by yourself. So here's a little homework to all you who make statements the above..."Why is china still or at least in to the very recent continued to use and even manufacture completely outdated weaponsystems (it's not tied to aircrafts alone)??

I give you a hint....it got something to do with over fifty years of lead that others have enjoyed in the industrialism

But anyway, back to the issue and without any personal comments

[Ryz05]

China is still producing "outdated" weapon systems because it doesn't need anything better since they are still more capable than what many of China's neighbors possess. Also, according to a defensive policy, the PLA strength lies in numbers. This is common sense when you are borded by 14 countries and don't have sufficient resource or skill to overshadow them by technological superiority. Don't underestimate the J-7G or other old model upgrades, because they still pack a punch when armed with the right missile systems and used as fire support. Although China started off late industrializing, its military developments have almost caught up with that of the West, shortening the 50 year lag to at least 20 years for the PLAAF, maybe 15 years for the PLAN, and 10 years for the PLA. This difference is likely to become (exponentially) shorter in the coming years.

No emotions were involved in the FC-1 discussion, at least on my part.

[Kilo636]

I think all that has already ended... China has stop producing J-7E/G. They are shifting to FC-1,J-11B and J-10.. With WZ-10 coming up next.
Who is going tp say China produced obsolete aircraft?

[Kilo636]

Originally Posted by bd popeye

Young man I have 20 years of actual military experience to judge these photos by. In my trained military eye I do not see a reason for a brand new aircraft fresh out of the factory to have weapons loaded on them.

Your military experience may be plenty but comes to spotting a real photo and a PSed, I have serious doubt on you! Maybe next time,you can study a photo hard enogh first before quickly jump into conclusion of a photo of PSed..

[tphuang]

Originally Posted by Kilo636

I think all that has already ended... China has stop producing J-7E/G. They are shifting to FC-1,J-11B and J-10.. With WZ-10 coming up next.
Who is going tp say China produced obsolete aircraft?

They were still producing J-7G this past year. I'm not sure if anymore will be produced this coming year, but if J-10 production can't ramp up to the point where it can replace the retiring J-7s, we might see even more J-7Gs.

[ahho]

Originally Posted by Ryz05

China is still producing "outdated" weapon systems because it doesn't need anything better since they are still more capable than what many of China's neighbors possess. Also, according to a defensive policy, the PLA strength lies in numbers. This is common sense when you are borded by 14 countries and don't have sufficient resource or skill to overshadow them by technological superiority. Don't underestimate the J-7G or other old model upgrades, because they still pack a punch when armed with the right missile systems and used as fire support. Although China started off late industrializing, its military developments have almost caught up with that of the West, shortening the 50 year lag to at least 20 years for the PLAAF, maybe 15 years for the PLAN, and 10 years for the PLA. This difference is likely to become (exponentially) shorter in the coming years.

No emotions were involved in the FC-1 discussion, at least on my part.

those have changed my friend.

on another note, are the new j-7e or g for exports or most of the exports are used ones?? About j-10 not being able to replace j-7s (i know that this has being discussed a bit before) why wouldn't plaaf use fc-1 as a replacement???
Both are single engine, similar in design (to a degree) and fc-1 has better radar and bvr capability (although a bit overated)

Oh by the way, what is the estimated cost of producing a j-7g and fc-1??

[alwaysfresh]

Originally Posted by Kilo636

Your military experience may be plenty but comes to spotting a real photo and a PSed, I have serious doubt on you! Maybe next time,you can study a photo hard enogh first before quickly jump into conclusion of a photo of PSed..

This is a direct personal attack. The following: "! Maybe next time,". The "!" and "Maybe next time" is counter-productive to communicating your position.

[pshamim]

Originally Posted by alwaysfresh

This is a direct personal attack. The following: "! Maybe next time,". The "!" and "Maybe next time" is counter-productive to communicating your position.

alwaysfresh!

Stop fanning the fire. Hopefully, you can increase everyone's knowledge by discussing the topic on hand. You are smart and I am sure you can provide your insight about the jf-17s