SinoDefence Forum

Engineer

Exactly. T/R modules for vhf/uhf would be Yagi antennas. An AESA in that frequency range would be so huge that it would dwarf the KJ-2000 in comparison.

Back then, cost was high due to lack of economic of scale. But as China put AESA on planes, on ships, and on ground, economic of scale takes over and the technology becomes much cheaper.

challenge

june 2009 issue of international defense review feature a photo of eriksson microwave L-band t/R module developed for eyrie,the module is quite big,slightly larger than your hand,similiar to the russian L-band T/R module (check australia airpower),by contrast x band T/R MMIC is no bigger than your thumb.
already russia manage to overcome this bottleneck,able to mass produce T/R MMIC,and I believe China may 2~3 years(less than) or 2011~2012 to achieve mass production capability.

rhino123

What you say are mostly consumer electronic items. I don't think it has anything to do with being backward or what. It is just something like - patentship. Since the Chinese wanted to sell their items out of China, they are no doubt be involved in some patentship stuff, so they cannot just start building and making the microprocessor and other high tech stuff that are already in use by other people.

I work in an consumer electronic company designing MP3 and stuffs, I know it is easier to import and use buy-from-the shelf items then to redesign and build something that can be bought easily, it has nothing to do with capability, it had something to do with cost and effectiveness.

maozedong

this is the old picture few years ago, up to now WS-15 should get more develop.

pla101prc

according to the discussion, most optimistic timeline is 2017-2018. so the test-flight will prolly be done with ws-10 or some russian engine...

challenge

speaking of avionic,around 2005 (2004?),wmf feature short article about Chinese equivalent of Pave Pillar Program.
the article do not provide technical detail,but one notice progress,example was DDG170.

King_Comm

This table has been circulating on the Chinese internet for some time


And I have translated it into English


If the 4th gen fight really is going to be like what Song Wencong proposed in 2001, it will be a totally awesome design, it's will have increased instability in both the pitch and yaw axis, low aspect ratio delta wings with LERX, directional control canard, small, all moving rudder and though caret style inlet was mentioned in the original paper, judging by the development on JF-17 and J-10B, DSI is more likely.

pla101prc

some Chinese site mentioned something about adjustable air-intake,which most ppl seemed to think is a bit too sci-fi lol. any comments from you experts on that?

Bltizo

Adjustable air intake? Sorry but aren't adjustable air intakes just variable air intakes?

King_Comm

Apparently, it's the inlet itself that moves rather than a movable ramp in the inlet. Personally, I am skeptical, as it has never been mentioned in any of the publised material or implemented on any aircraft.

pla101prc

that's y its called a new design. the rumour says that since China cant make an engine that can match the American ones, the only way they can match f-22 in terms of maneuverability is to work on the airframe,this was part of it.

latenlazy

Doesn't make any sense. Putting in a mechanism like that would increase weight drastically compared to a DSI, which would hurt, not help.

On the other hand, they could be talking about a system like the A-12 series (like the SR-71s) where the intake moves in some way relative to the airspeed in order to increase efficiency, but it still sounds like fan boy nonsense, and I don't see why they'd need something like that for a fighter.

maozedong

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lets see this video to listen PLA geneal Zhang Zhaozhong talk about the 4th generation fighters, he was confident that the Chinese had developed a new generation of fighters with the ability to, the maiden flight could be within 1-2 years there was another expert in the conversation. But they are all thought to have a very long test flight time,about how long the 4th generation fighters deploy the troops, that depends on the test flight circumstances.

tphuang

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I guess interviewing an expert about China's 4th generation fighter jet.

First, the man basically that if the deputy commander said first flight is coming soon, it will probably happen in the next 1 or 2 years. Normally the time it takes to go from first flight to FOC is 10 years, because you have to go through a bunch of tests to reach the design specifications.

Another interview basically stated that you know people are surprised because the time frame gave by the deputy commander is much more ambitious than what would normally be expected (especially in the case of F-22, which took 10 years), whereas China is only taking 6 to 8 years, but seems like PLAAF is very confident with the progress.

The original interview said China has grown up and moved from copying Russians to developing its own jet in terms of J-10. J-10 took 20 years to be fully developed and operational. However, it only took FC-1 2 years to go from first flight to operational. I think this is over stating it a little bit since it's only talking about prototype 04 and I'd say it's more like 3 years and I'm not sure if it has achieved FOC for PAF yet.

After that, it sort of trailed off, so I stopped listening.

pla101prc

i wouldnt bet on such a quick flight test. engine is still THE big issue. hopefully by the time flight tests have been completed the engine will also. if flight tests starts next year, i say 2020 is a reasonable time slot.