SinoDefence Forum

NightHook

Yes it is, in the way all HYBRID ESA are similar to AESA. It's receiver part function exactly like AESA radar, it have more than 1000 receiver modules. BARS function same way. BTW, from 2008 Indian BARS finally have ability to programaticaly alter it's side lobs, witch is BY FAR most important quality of AESA / HESA radars (for military,not for forum fans). What is unique for Irbis is shear power,achieved by using two TWT's.
Irbis have 4 monopulse channels (Bars have 3), not something great per se, it's simple because using two twt's.

From this sumer mass production started (in two different companies).

Russians did not developed practically no new shipborne radar since USSR fail.
But surveillance radars? You must be kidding? Search for NEBO-SVU or Gamma DE for example.

I don't know what lilzz think , but i KNOW it will be (relatively) easy for them. First AESA (not experimental) appeared in USSR in 1979!!! Why some people think you need GA modules for every AESA is beyond me (radar from 1979 use 80 klystrons). Compact radars, of course, need small T\R modules but all other work can be done with not solid state components. (Nebo-SVU and Gamma-DE use solid state T\R modules)

lilzz

Yeah 1960s, computer using vaccum tube, base on your reason why comupter today need solid state sub nm prcoess, why not just use vaccum tube?


Hint, vaccum tube, klystron can't fit into the head of the fighter. second excessive lost of energy, breakdown of tube, reliability issue, ...everything about vaccum tube are just sucks. Even my Grandpa would throw that junk away.


China has better solid state /semiconductor technology than Russia but it just in a funk, can't seem translate that well to military.

Hyperwarp

Yeah...

I personally have no doubts about the Russian ability...Especially the Soviet days.....They have a long history....

MiG-31 carried worlds 1st fighter Phased-Array RADAR.

The present lag-behind has more to do with horror days that came after SU collapsed.

Hyperwarp

The manufacturing technology alone is not enough. Thats like saying a foundry having the ability to make ##nm process can also design a great microarchitecture?

tphuang

right, let's do that. Let's call every PESA radar AESA. Let's redefine the definition of AESA so that the Russians (and you) can say that they do.

right, since they don't have any fighters using AESA radar in the next while, why don't you show who is producing them and for what and the cost?
when I say surveillance, I was talking about AWACS and you bring up a VHF radar and solid state phased array radar? And is there any support to them being AESA? I have never heard of VHF band radar being AESA.
right, you are saying that the two major firms have just been sitting on their butt the entire time? So it's easy that the Americans are already operational with their 2nd generation of fighter AESA radar and NIIP is finally showing a model of what their radar will look like?

Crobato knows more about Russian radar than I do, but let's just say that the recent Russian ventures into the fighter radar development world hasn't been too great. Do you know what happened to Pero antenna or Zhuk-MSE or Zhuk-MFE or Zhuk-MSF? Yeah, me neither.

challenge

more info on russian AESA program from australian airpower com.
russian trying to interest the PLAAF to purchased zhuk-MSE AESA radar to retrofit existing su-27/J-11 fleet.
to date there are no response from ther Chinese,it is likely that Chinese AESA may already been undergoing test flight test.according to brief article from wmf, claim that detection range (max.)for J-10B radar is 200km,there are no mention whether this radar is PESA or AESA,but it may be pointed at AESA.
NORA/ RBE-2- max. range 195km. APG-80 (F-16)-200 km

crobato

The one on the J-10B is obviously some kind of electronically scanned radar. Radome space is too small for a radar dish to pivot, and the firewall, meaning the backwall, is canted, which means the radar is most likely to be fixed in a canted position.

Real innovation in radars is in the software.

__________________
"Lets do a thermal sweep."

Hyperwarp

Its off-course from Carlo Kopp, but you can get some details: NNIIRT Nebo SVU / RLM-M Nebo M / Assessing Russia's First Mobile VHF AESA

More from Copp: http://www.ausairpower.net/APA-Rus-Low-Band-Radars.html

He has allot of JSF bashing but, you can get some details

Hyperwarp

Well the F-16, F/A-18, F-CK-1 also have rather small noses....

But, that being said,

You right about its position. Its canted. Question is, whether its AESA or not. J-10B, J-10B

PS:

Skywatcher watcher was right. There was a video where the interviewee claimed the J-10A had an ESA.....

Skywatcher

I don't know if the ESA is specific to all J-10A models, or just some trial run.

My guess is that it would be AESA, mainly because we haven't seen too much Chinese work on PESA compared to AESA.

plawolf

Well I think the main point is that it looks noticeably smaller then the J10A's nose.

There is no good reason to make the nose smaller unless you expect to get at least similar radar performance out of it, and together with the canted nose strongly suggest ESA.

tphuang

yeah, that sounds about right. Kopp has never been ashamed of being a little loose with technical details.

lilzz

I did a google search on "China 12Ghz 10Ghz T/R Module RF Highpower"

no specific products come up. Do they make them for commercial products too?

crobato

Don't let the fanbois mouthing defense brochures they read fool you, planars are actually very efficient antennas.

__________________
"Lets do a thermal sweep."