SinoDefence Forum

MIGleader

the russians planned to upgrade six su-27s to skm standard in 06. its phase one of the su-35 upgrade plan bm.

i thought the chiense had deemed it to costly to refit the jh-7 with al-31. isnt it a bit to powerful? ws-13 or rd-93(with no smoke!) is better.

tphuang

I personally think upgrading to su-35 from su-27s is too difficult, because of the upgrade that needs to be done to structure and with the new engine and such.

As for JH-7A, it was deemed to be too costly too redesign to fit two AL-31F engines, but JH-7B is a new design.

Sea Dog

Isn't this called the FB-7? If it's what I think you're talking about, this aircraft will significantly bolster China's ability to strike targets in all-weather environments and will have the avionics installed to carry better anti-ship weaponry. And If I'm not mistaken, it will increase range by about 20%.

sumdud

Wait, isn't the JH-7B suppose to be the Su-32-alike project? Or is it an upgrade to the JH-7A?
The JH-7A might be able to carry more than 5 tonnes. The WS-9 is afterall, by majority a copy. I doubt there are much increases.
And 9 tonnes is just ridiculous.
Hmm...... I don't really trust it.

And if the JH-7B is the Su-32 bomer, why don't they give it a different name? They are different planes.

__________________

Give us a break. Don't try ranting at SDF.

tphuang

that's why it's speculated as JH-7B or JH-8.

trkl

Why is it ridiculous? The Tornado can carry 9 tons and its engines are even weaker than the origional Speys. The real question is, why was the payload of the origional JH-7 so low? Was there a structural problem? Was the 5 tons information innacurate?

MIGleader

engines recive different upgrades and so. the speys china had were stripped from old raf phantoms anyways.
http://www.aeronautics.ru/nws001/ai014.htm

Chairman Hu

spey and Jian-11B... i apologize for bring up the JH-7...

If the Jian-11B is gonna be based from any Russian planes, might as well be the MKK2 in some aspects for the ship attacks, and the Su-35 for air to air with some ground retal.

If i remember correctly, the mockup of the Jian-11 had 2001 on the side of the cockpit and carried R-77s and Kh-31s

MKK3 and 35 is the best bet

MIGleader

yup. at least 40 j-11s have gotten the 2001 upgrade, though not with kh-31s. mkk3 has been cancelled. doesnt meet chinas requirments. as for the su-34...well just have to wait and see if china actually buys it, or decides to make a indegedous plane based on it.

tphuang

The thought is that su-34 isn't up for export. They are even trying to use it as a testbed for their new AESA radar. As for mkk3, China is more interested in su-33M, which is for all intense purpose a foldable version of mkk3 and is perfect to put on Varyag. So, that's why China has no interest in mkk3.

MIGleader

nah, the chinese simply werent happy with the mkk and mkk2. better go with a new design. russia has never said the su-34 was or wasnt for sale. china just needs to buy it to help develop an indegedous attacker.

Chairman Hu

Right now I really dont see the point of the Su-34 anymore, since the JH-7B is said to have 9.5 tonnes of weapons carried, I mean if China can pull up from 6 tonnes or so, why not a ton or 2 more and work on radar and firing/control systems, maybe redesign the front like the Su-34?

and sell all the old JH-7s to other country to provide money, I really dont think selling it cheap and having like 6 tonnes can be rejected by 3rd-world countries, I mean, doesnt the Su-27 carry 6 tonnes as well?

well okie anyways, we all can agree that the Jian-11 can is based on somewhere at the level of the 27SKM, some say MKK/2/3, and some (if lucky enough) 35BM, what about the possible idea of having each version based a different fighter? Like upgrading the 11A to strict air superiority mission, and leave the 11B based on the 35BM, and 11C to be based on the Su-33M?

I dont think this idea came up, but if it did, correct me

MIGleader

i have a feeling that at least 75% of the jh-7b's characteristics and technology is going to come from the su-34. so it wouldnt hurt to obtain a few models to test and evaluate.

what the future holds for the j-10 is still very much in doubt. lets not forget the j-10 entered service only a year ago. a rather interesting idea is to convert the two seater j-10b to be a multirole combat aircraft.

as for the carrier plane...no one knows.
i wish good luck to the j-11b program
and the j-xx program.
but i think weve pretty much ezhausted this topic, so we should lay off till more info becoms available.

Chairman Hu

Well heres the problem... "YOU" think that the JH-7B is 75% based from the Su-34, we really dunno... to tell you the truth, I hope that this is true, this can solve alot of the problems of the JH-7 and give considerable attack power to China... I wish it wasn't "YOU" think, I wish it was "YOU" know or itz true, itz too bad...

Yea agreed, since we did and all thats lets is pretty much argument on rather it be based from whatever, Dongfeng is right, an air-superiority version with considerable attack power and a naval version are the only ones to be needed probably. Hey mods, how about just closing this but leave it here though? thanks!

crobato

The best option for the future J-11 is to leverage J-10 technology on it. Let's cut out the Su-35BM, Su-32, MKK, MK2, MK3 speculation.

If J-11 and J-10 has common parts, it would lower the cost of production for both, since you can increase the production volume of the components to meet the demands for these two planes.

It would ease logistics, since a base can stock parts that would be good for both planes.

It would make maintenance easier, since the technician can work on both planes.

You have better weapons compatibility, since the same missile can be used on both planes.

By leveraging J-10 technology, you can build a plane like this:

1. Using composite technology. The Su-27 airframe using Chinese metallurgy and composites in other portions. The factories that are molding these components for the J-10 can do so for the J-11.

2. Use digital FBW. If you already have the components, all you need is to reprogram the flight rules in the box to match the Su-27's flight behavior. It's probably easier for the Su-27 since it is inherently more stable than the J-10.

3. Use avionics from the J-10, such as the radar, cockpit, HUD, RWR, and so on. Note it would make it easier to train in one and fly the other.

4. Use the WS-10A engine on both.

I don't think you can create a super Flanker out of this, but you can make at least something better than the generic Su-27SK. It would be relatively affordable and easier to maintain too.