Formation to go against stealth fighters like F22, and F35..

Doesn't sound good idea to me
How do you know there come a B-2 or F-22, since they are stealth?
How do you know the F-22 won't shot down the advanced fighter the first round it attacks?

Those cheap UCAV's will be stiffiled by ECM emitted by US aircraft & ships...Seems I remember some time ago some one else suggesting such a manuver...

Originally Posted by bd popeye

Those cheap UCAV's will be stiffiled by ECM emitted by US aircraft & ships...Seems I remember some time ago some one else suggesting such a manuver...

I am suggesting a scenario when US is doing a covert hit and run bombing mission deep into enemy territories using B-2 and stealth fighters. I don't think the ship can get that close to the mainland due to anti-ship missiles. I don't think ECM can work that far away. If they try, I let them sample my anti-radiation missiles.

The anti-stealth radar pick up so faint signal and fighters are send up to intercept. This is formation is especially formed to go against stealth planes.

Originally Posted by scorpioking

Doesn't sound good idea to me
How do you know there come a B-2 or F-22, since they are stealth?
How do you know the F-22 won't shot down the advanced fighter the first round it attacks?

The anti-stealth radar pick up some signals and after analysis the signature tells me it's not a conventional plane. So, I send up special formation to counter the stealth planes also to kill the B-2s, prepare to attack 2 birds /w one stone. ALso the UCAVs are in front of the advanced fighters.

So, you saying you can distinguish between an advance fighter in the pack and just kill that fighter and leave the UCAVs alone. the UCAVs will still shoot at you if you don't shoot at them and if they get close enough to you.

If you decide to shoot at lot of UCAVs and fighters then it will expose yourself position to the SAMs also.

Originally Posted by lilzz

I am suggesting a scenario when US is doing a covert hit and run bombing mission deep into enemy territories using B-2 and stealth fighters. I don't think the ship can get that close to the mainland due to anti-ship missiles. I don't think ECM can work that far away. If they try, I let them sample my anti-radiation missiles.

The anti-stealth radar pick up so faint signal and fighters are send up to intercept. This is formation is especially formed to go against stealth planes.

USN also has airborne ECM capabilities; the EA-6 Prowler, and the new EA-18 Growler. And I will bet that they would be heavily escorted.

Also, the whole purpose of stealth is to make something appear something else. If I can make a fighter jet look like a bird, or some ground clutter, your going to be very busy investigating all the possible contacts. Also, your going to need radars all over the place, as there will be large gaps in coverage where a stealth aircraft is virtually undetectable. And if your radars are static and fixed, a ELINT aircraft or even satellite recon can pinpoint the radar location, and they can be TLAMed.

Originally Posted by Pointblank

USN also has airborne ECM capabilities; the EA-6 Prowler, and the new EA-18 Growler. And I will bet that they would be heavily escorted.

The whole purpose of using stealth bombers is for covert operation, hit and run type of scenario. Try to be undetectable. Now, You bring along a whole bunch of other stuffs for ECM purpose. Aren't you defeating your purpose. Not to mention those planes would not be able survive the SAMs.

Originally Posted by lilzz

The whole purpose of using stealth bombers is for covert operation, hit and run type of scenario. Try to be undetectable. Now, You bring along a whole bunch of other stuffs for ECM purpose. Aren't you defeating your purpose. Not to mention those planes would not be able survive the SAMs.

You can use such jets to degrade enemy air defences or to draw attention away from certain areas.

The whole purpose of these Wild Weasel jets is to directly interfere and attack enemy radar positions. No Allied aircraft were lost in the first Iraq War when there was a Wild Weasel escort to SAM's. They can jam radars very effectively, and also disrupt any radio communications within a given area. In short, you can create enough havoc in one area to hide activity in another or confuse the enemy.

Originally Posted by Pointblank

You can use such jets to degrade enemy air defences or to draw attention away from certain areas.

The whole purpose of these Wild Weasel jets is to directly interfere and attack enemy radar positions. No Allied aircraft were lost in the first Iraq War when there was a Wild Weasel escort to SAM's. They can jam radars very effectively, and also disrupt any radio communications within a given area. In short, you can create enough havoc in one area to hide activity in another or confuse the enemy.

Iraq is an easy pushover, so let's not use iraq as the standard.
I don't think those conventional plane can penetrate airspace and survive the SAMs. I think as soon as those Wild Weasel jet launched from your base, the enemy already know they are coming far away. Probably got Shot down before those weasels can enter the coastal line.

Originally Posted by lilzz

Iraq is an easy pushover, so let's not use iraq as the standard.
I don't think those conventional plane can penetrate airspace and survive the SAMs. I think as soon as those Wild Weasel jet launched from your base, the enemy already know they are coming far away. Probably got Shot down before those weasels can enter the coastal line.

The same applies to Operation Allied Force. These systems can easily jam, and disrupt communications and radars very effectively.

I think going after each "promising" blimp on an "anti-stealth-radar" will need a lot of such formations, since there will be a lot of blimps.
You also need to maintain those aircraft between sorties. To still have a sufficient number on alert/ in the air, you need many, wich will be expensive and complex.
Also, for the UCAVs to be able to attack planes on their own in case they are recognized and ignored, they need a good radar, sophisticated AI and so on, what will make them not so cheap any more.

Originally Posted by Scratch

I think going after each "promising" blimp on an "anti-stealth-radar" will need a lot of such formations, since there will be a lot of blimps.
You also need to maintain those aircraft between sorties. To still have a sufficient number on alert/ in the air, you need many, wich will be expensive and complex.
Also, for the UCAVs to be able to attack planes on their own in case they are recognized and ignored, they need a good radar, sophisticated AI and so on, what will make them not so cheap any more.

For starters, there's no sacrifice of live experienced pilots, I think that's "cheap" in a sense. Alot of those older generation fighter plane can be converted into UCAVs. Still using those older radar and weapons So, it's all about software and control.

I read the article, the supercomputers are used to analyze those blimp and make reasonable assumption whether they are stealth plane or not.

Originally Posted by lilzz

For starters, there's no sacrifice of live experienced pilots, I think that's "cheap" in a sense. Alot of those older generation fighter plane can be converted into UCAVs. Still using those older radar and weapons So, it's all about software and control.

I read the article, the supercomputers are used to analyze those blimp and make reasonable assumption whether they are stealth plane or not.

Super computers that are large, fixed, and can be TLAMed. There goes your super computers...

Iraq is an easy pushover, so let's not use iraq as the standard.

We've had this argument before in this forum....In fact Iraq had state of the art Russian air defenses radars etc....They did not have junk. Same goes for Lybia in 1986...

I can no longer find the links...

Originally Posted by Pointblank

Super computers that are large, fixed, and can be TLAMed. There goes your super computers...

The receivers are passive system, they don't emit any radiation signals and they are all spread out. Also the receivers and the central computer cluster are not even in the same site. I don't not sure how you go about to find the Super computer.