SinoDefence Forum

utelore

Does anyone know the quality of the FLIR that sets just below the cockpit of the SU-27/30. I understand it is some kind of IR/detector with FLIR properties. does it work good? how does it compare to western FLIR tech??

I know on my tank in the open desert I used it a lot like radar. I would go to "white hot" and scan the horizon looking for heat signatures. I know once I crossed a phase line and nothing but enemy was in zone it became my radar as all metal objects in the open desert light up like a candle on TIS(thermal imaging system) even hull and turret down AFV's would give off sort of a weird "heat plume" at times especially if there engines had recently ran to recharge their batteries. Is this the same way the pilots of those aircraft use it??

The western pilots that I have talked to run to attack using radar or turn their radars off and get data link info from other larger radar aircraft. They have said they never search using IR but at closer ranges the sidewinder will utterly yell at you when it has a target.

Scratch

As far as I'm familiar with it, the Russians quiet pioniered that IRST tech. Today, the Flankers IRST -OEPS-27 I think- is said to have a detection range of 40-100km, depending on target aspect and signature.
Some F-4 versions actually had a FLIR before that, but these were later abondoned and not pursued on later aircraft. Probably because of the rather poor performance back then.
The F-14 had a TV camara on board to ID targets I think, but were not generally used to search for targets. Only now on aircraft like Rafalé, EF and the F-18 E/F blockII are long range IR searching and tracking systems introduced to western aircraft. Also with detection ranges of up to 100km. They are able to detect "hotter dots" before beackground. ID is only possible at much shorter distances though, unless you use IFF.
Those western FLIRs were more to get images of the ground ahead, but not dedicated air-search sensors until recently.

In your tank, I guess that detection ranges of several miles were probably enough (how far could you actually see?), but with the speeds involed in air-combat you need of course greater ranges.
But then again if you can reliably search for other aircraft at several tens of miles out, you can look for them without giving away your presence through active radiation.

utelore

At 2000+ meters I could not ID a T-72 from a Abrams at least on my big boys TIS. some TIS work better than other TIS even the same make. you were always happy if you got a good TIS when yours burnt out. BUT if we got the "no friendly to front sit-rep" then I would shoot with little worry. Just aim toward the center of the hot spot and ON THE WAY. The biggest secret is moving. If the enemy moves it dies. IF ya lie still and are near other hot stuff it makes it harder to ID and kill.

PS: BMP were always very easy to spot even at 2000+ also I saw some jar head M-60A3 with better TIS than abrams. too funny

challenge

according to worldairpower.com russian IRST unlike western counterpart,do not adapt focal plane array,and may not be as good .but improve version may be on the market soon.
Chinese Technical magazine in 2005 report of new version of IRST uses 3nd gen. IR detector.with twice the detection range over the Russian ir detector.

utelore

I think in the next modern war, active radar will mean the death sentence of the target if he/she is operating active radar. with All the High speed/low speed missiles out there that run passive looking for active radar it is truly a deadly enviorment.

The next modern war like russia vs EU or china vs ROC/U.S will prove that mans place on the battle field will start to come to a close because of all the missile development with ranges in 100km

Scratch

But then again I see no technology that could replace radars capabilities, wich are still needed. Getting a precise picture of the battlespace with distances, speeds and headings will still require active sensors. Maybe Ladar can do that job sometime in the future. But heaving a strong enough source in a fighter sized aircraft is still some time off.
With the modern IRST the use of radar might decrease, but not vanish. A quick look from time to time will be quiet usefull.